Monday, July 17, 2006

"BANKING ON HEAVEN" Documentary

I'm the director of the new doc, "BANKING ON HEAVEN". To give you folks a little background, my producer & I began the film a little over 3 years ago and have just finished the final edit. The DVD should be available in 2 weeks at bankingonheaven.com.

When we bagan filming in Colorado City & Hildale, there was no other media coverage (that I know of) other than John Dougherty & Mike Watkis. The walls there weren't up yet, so we got a lot of footage and interviews that are entirely impossible today. We also attracted local police and goons who did everything possible to intimidate us and run us off. Sometimes, when the threats were serious, they did run us off, but they never intimidated us, other that the usual nausea, vomiting and nightmares (joke).

I've enjoyed reading your posts, and hope to become a participating member of this thread.

89 comments:

Anonymous said...

I would't give the film the time of Day. Waste of Money and Time. Would Rather Watch MSMBC or Donald Duck.

Anonymous said...

Why would you say that?

Anonymous said...

Just watching the trailer you can tell it is the biggest pile of the worst b.s. from the press.

Anonymous said...

I thought the name of your movie was BIG LOVE IS A BIG LIE.

Anonymous said...

I look forward to seeing it. I just looked up your website and was a little disappointed there was no launch date for the DVD. I think the first annonymous poster on this site is probably upset because you filmed their "mysterious" and scary lifestyle and put in on film where they are exposed. If I were them, I would be very embarrassed too. Thank you for the film. Again, I look forward to seeing it.

Anonymous said...

I am looking forward to seeing it.

The B.S. that someone mentioned earlier isn't from the press/media... the B.S. is that this has gone on for so long and so many are still in denial.

With the amount of Anonymous posts I will use my posting name.

Walton aka Cooper

Anonymous said...

Lets make a Movie about all of the divorces in Monogamy and Cheating and Spouse Abuse and Child Abuse,all the vices of that Society and then Lets Call it BANKING ON HELL. This Producer of this movie needs to focus on the good of this society. Oh I apologize this is a very corrupt society and needs to be obliberated off the planet. The LDS people think that they can just Mock the God of Jacob and make fun of this society, but he says D&C 132 Says "NO ONE CAN REJECT THIS COVENANT AND BE PERMITTED TO ENTER INTO MY GLORY" Did anyone catch the phrase (NO ONE), Oh! except the President of the Church. All those that have this law revealed unto them must and SHALL ABIDE THIS LAW OR THEY SHALL BE DAMNED.D&C 132. I quess according to their ideas, they are going to live it in the next life. I guess being LDS I will just plan on paying my Tithing in the next life, go to church in the next life,receive my Temple ordinces in the next life, and get Babtized in the next life Etc. If they make a law to Ban one Principle can't they make a law to Ban another Principle. So if they made laws too Ban all of the Principles of the Gospel, Since the LDS Church succumed to the Ban on Polygamy,whats next? Those who live Godly in Christ SHALL SUFFER PERSECUTION Why? because they won't back down. God's law will not be trifled with. God is watching us from a distance.

Anonymous said...

You could make a movie on divorces in Monogamy and Cheating,, but WITHOUT having to do it secretly because the rest of society is an open society. The FLDS know they are wrong, otherwise they wouldn't hide so much and keep everything so secretive. If nothing so awful is happening in the FLDS open your doors to the world. Invite them in and show them you are doing nothing wrong. Invite them in and show them that the FLDS has nothing to hide and they live a wonderful life. Why, if everything is so wonderful in the FLDS, does everything have to be hidden?????????????????????//

Anonymous said...

How about the FLDS open their doors to the outside world and show them that there is nothing wrong going on inside the FLDS. Then, maybe, the world would be satisfied that child abuse is not rampant. Show us that there is nothing wrong going on. If everything is so wonderful then why not be proud of it and share it with others? Huh..what an idea. Why not open your doors and let us see how loving and wonderful life in the FLDS is.

Plus, we could have a movie as you have spoken about regarding the monogamy lifestyle. I would say if we did the abuse of the system would not be so rampant in it.

Please, open your doors, invite us in and show us that everything is fine. Allow your children to run and play in front of the public without having to hide when a stranger passes. Any other religion that believes in themselves welcomes others so they can show them how wonderful life is in their world. Do the same and the movies won't have to be written and produced.

Anonymous said...

Explain the good part about this society please.

The "visions" have been a little blurry over the last hundred plus years.

The good part of this society is hidden behind all the "walls" and the details of Child Abuse being reported.

The good part of this society is covered like the mounds of dirt on the unmarked graves of babies.

Is this done by those who live "Godly in Christ"?

Yes, God is watching and I doubt very much that he is smiliing.

Walton aka Cooper

Anonymous said...

Anonymous@10:34 said: "All those that have this law revealed unto them must and SHALL ABIDE THIS LAW OR THEY SHALL BE DAMNED.D&C 132. I quess according to their ideas, they are going to live it in the next life."

Even I have to take out my own trash. As with all the other modifications done concerning this book, this is something they should leave out on purpose and yell it to the world of the latest edit.

Walton aka Cooper

giz2gaz said...

I can understand why some within the FLDS may not like the idea of a film that reveals the abuses that go on behind closed doors. People in the FLDS and those who have escaped or been thrown out consistently confirm that abuse is rampant. That includes both physical abuse and emotional abuse. What's happening to the people in CC & Hildale is a CRIME of the worst magnitude and must be stopped. Now. That's why I made the film. To wake the people of America up.

Anonymous said...

The people insulting this film must be followers of Warren or simply are in denial (which is NOT a river in Egypt) that the "BS" IS happening.

It's not like one person is saying these things either. What about the lost boys, Fawn H. & Fawn B., Ruth Stubbs, Pennie Peterson, Laurene Jessop & even Brent Jeffs who was sodmized by Jeffs. Are ALL these people liars or "apostates"? I don't think so.

A Concerned Texan

Anonymous said...

giggaz you say you just finished the final edit.

Did'nt you enter your film in the vancover film festival last september.(almost a year ago)

Hmm, your facts don't seem to ad up.

Would you care to explain?

Anonymous said...

The people insulting this film must be followers of Warren or simply are in denial (which is NOT a river in Egypt) that the "BS" IS happening.

It's not like one person is saying these things either. What about the lost boys, Fawn H. & Fawn B., Ruth Stubbs, Pennie Peterson, Laurene Jessop & even Brent Jeffs who was sodmized by Jeffs. Are ALL these people liars or "apostates"? I don't think so.

A Concerned Texan

giz2gaz said...

Hey, everyone, I appologize for my inept postings that seem to land all over the place. Atari has kindly given me some help, so hopefully I won't continue to disrupt everything.

giz2gaz said...

Yes, the film's world premier was in Vancoouver, BC last October. Since then I've discovered many new sources of information and, instead of releasing the film, I continued filming so as to get the story more current. I wanted to be absolutely certain that there were no inaccuracies and that all sides of the issue were given voice.

unrestrained said...

I have not been a poster on this blog, just a silent observer from afar,yet originally, from very close.

I have a question for all those still living in CC. If there is nothing going on why the aggression? Why the hiding? Why not embrace the attention from the media to help your society get funding for schools, for better health care that is not paid for by the tax payers. Surely if there is some bad going on and you don't personally see it you would want it taken care of anyway! I can't imagine any of you are comfortable with child abuse, spouse abuse or underage marriage. Whether polygamist or monogomist.
Food for thought.

ATAR_i said...

10:34 - I think I just threw up in my mouth.

unrestrained said...

That sounds like a personal problem.

fttc said...

The FLDS cannot come to terms with the fact that this is not about polygamy. 10:34 is an example. If warren was not marrying underage girls and tearing families apart left and right there would be no problems with the law. While Plural Marriage is a tenet of the Gospel marrying young girls is not. There is nothing in the Mormon scriptures or the Bible which can be used to justify it. The Lord has told us (followers of JS) that we must obey the law of the land unless it conflicts with the Laws of God. (Constitutional law will not conflict). There is a law against marrying young girls in Utah. Anyone who is living the principles JS taught will not then marry an underage girl in violation of that law.

warren will continue to violate the laws of God and his country and his followers will continue to call themselves persecuted for it. It is a paradox that is driving some participants literally out of thier minds. If not quelled by those involved it will end in the destruction of a once happy and industrious community.

ATAR_i said...

unrestrained - my comment wasn't directed at you.

Anonymous said...

"It's not like one person is saying these things either. What about the lost boys, Fawn H. & Fawn B., Ruth Stubbs, Pennie Peterson, Laurene Jessop & even Brent Jeffs who was sodmized by Jeffs. Are ALL these people liars or "apostates"?"

YES! And some are just liars, others are apostates like Judas Iscariot, wanting to kill what they used to love.

" If there is nothing going on why the aggression? Why the hiding? Why not embrace the attention from the media to help your society get funding for schools, for better health care that is not paid for by the tax payers. Surely if there is some bad going on and you don't personally see it you would want it taken care of anyway! I can't imagine any of you are comfortable with child abuse, spouse abuse or underage marriage. Whether polygamist or monogomist."

We dont need anythig from you, the supposed aggression is called self defense.

Just watch the trailer and there you can see aggression, there you can see the society at large being brainwashed into submitting to the hate against us.


People leave your religion's out there don't they? People get divorced in your society don't they? Girls under 18 get married to men 10 years their senior in your society dont they? 16 and 17 year olds get pregnant in your society dont they? Those of you who think it is not about Polygny are fooling yourselves, not us.

Anonymous said...

5:39--There is indeed problems out here as well. What the FLDS need to realize is that they are on the same globe as the rest of the world. An us vs them mentality is very dangerous.

Now, saying everyone who leaves is a liar is quite a stretch. I have witnessed Warren blatantly lie to the people himself. You may say, "when?" Well, he stated when a group of people left shortly after Rulon passed away that "the guilty flee when no man pursueth." Now, the people he had reference to were warned by Uncle Fred (yes, Uncle Fred was somewhat of a traitor himself)--they were warned that Warren wanted to do a public execution to them like he did to the Barlows and about 20 others. These men left, and then Warren lies through his teeth saying that no man pursued them.

Now, if Warren can lie, isn't it easier to assume that maybe not everything against him is a lie? When someone who is known to lie says everything against them is a lie, they don't have a lot of credence, do they?

unrestrained said...

anon: 5:39

You are so quick to draw a line in the sand determining sides. I lived there. I know first hand. I do not live there now and I know first hand what the other side is like.
If you are truly happy with everything that is going on in CC, that is great. I get a great perspective because I have seen both sides.
Yes, the same things happen in the non CC world also. When people break the law they get punished. The same should hold true for people that are breaking the law in CC. No one is saying the entire culture is bad. Child abuse, spouse abuse and under age marriage is illegal no matter what religion you practice, no matter what state you live in and no matter what color you are.
If you could be less emotional about this and realize these topis are in the news all the time in every part of the US. I am not disputing that, just suggested you turn what you think is negative into positive.
Like another blogger suggested, if you have nothing to hide there is no issue.
Right?

Anonymous said...

What I find interesting is cults universally declare that everyone who defects from the cult is a liar. Anon 5:39 showed the same tendency. Warren isn't the only cult leader out there, and universally, when someone gets caught up in the cult spirit of denial, anything against their holy leader immediately becomes a lie to them.

ATAR_i said...

5:39 Unfortunately what we say to you probably won't make sense to you until a certain moment - the moment when you realize that the men you idolize, are human also, and fully capable of sin/mistakes like the rest of us.

I don't fault you for that, many of us here had that moment. We were fully committed, completely dedicated, utterly devoted and then you see something that you hadn't seen before.

What you say about those outside FLDS is absolutely true - sin, it's everywhere - including FLDS. The underwear and old fashioned hairstyles are not armour against the fall of man.

I have no interest in persecuting you, or setting you aside to torture you for your beliefs - I would never want to do that.

It's because your leadership (nothing from the BOM, D&C) have been marrying young girls to really old men, and your parents abandoning underage boys. Those have nothing to do with religion, those are the day to day business decisions of your leadership.

If it were not for those things, you would merely be some interesting group of polygamists. And, not being a taxpayer in Utah or Arizona - your existence would probably not upset me.

Polygamy is interesting - true - but only soooo interesting. It's the other 'over the top' crazy wild happenings that are causing the natives to be restless. Is your leadership setting up for a confrontation - honestly, the way they conduct themselves - it seems like they are wanting to provoke a response and then say 'I told you they were after us'.

Interesting

Anonymous said...

"Now, the people he had reference to were warned by Uncle Fred (yes, Uncle Fred was somewhat of a traitor himself)--they were warned that Warren wanted to do a public execution to them like he did to the Barlows and about 20 others. These men left, and then Warren lies through his teeth saying that no man pursued them."

You can tell that you left because that is a blatant lie. (only slightly kidding) Uncle Fred was Warren Jeffs greatest supporter. I was there too.

"It's because your leadership (nothing from the BOM, D&C) have been marrying young girls to really old men, and your parents abandoning underage boys. Those have nothing to do with religion, those are the day to day business decisions of your leadership."

To say that is the reason they put Warren Jeffs on the top ten most wanted list is niave at best. Young women marry old men in your society also. Rebellious boys run away or are told to move out in your society also.

I know what it is that you hate, (besides polygny) and I hate it too. That is the perception of being forced.

Let me put your minds at ease, no one is forced to get married in the FLDS, at any age, and no one is forced to stay.

Isnt that what you all want those who are FLDS to do? To leave? Soooo Sorry, aint gunna happen.

Anonymous said...

Oh another thing proving your lie:

"they were warned that Warren wanted to do a public execution to them like he did to the Barlows and about 20 others. These men left, and then Warren lies through his teeth saying that no man pursued them."

They left before the Barlows and 20 others were publicly exhiled.

And who pursued them?

Uncle Ratt said...

OTS, Welcome back. Why do you have to sneak in as anonymous? Are you ashamed of your identity or did you get kicked off? Again, welcome back Steve.

Uncle Ratt said...

Walton aka Cooper,
I'm curious about you. You sound like an intelligent person. Could you give us a little background about yourself?

giz2gaz said...

unrestrained said...
"When people break the law they get punished. The same should hold true for people that are breaking the law in CC. No one is saying the entire culture is bad. Child abuse, spouse abuse and under age marriage is illegal no matter what religion you practice, no matter what state you live in and no matter what color you are."

That's the whole point. Almost every one of the scores of people I interviewed said they didn't give a rats ass about people choosing to practice polygamy. "The issue is ABUSE!" proclaims Aunt J in the film. And what's going on there is also illegal. What's the least bit controversial about stopping welfare fraud & abuse? Nobody cares who the Warrenites worship. Yeah, most of the thousand or so people who have seen the film are a trifle aghast at the way the CC folks dress, and they're shocked that such a large community could be hidden in isolation in 21st century America, but I've never heard a single person condemn the FLDS religion.

In fact, one of Jeffs' most ardent defenders condemns "people who hide under the church to do their evil. It's a matter of the law. They need to prosecute." This person obviously doesn't think Jeffs is behind any of the abuses, but does name names of those who carry out his orders.

Anonymous said...

Please excuse my bad manners. I didn't introduce myself.

Average Joe that is just a bit more vocal about things then others.

I don't know about being intelligent but I do know when to come in out of the rain. :)

My spelling is terrible but my intentions are good.

I use to tip-toe around certain issues but I've learned over the years, it is just best to come straight out and say it like I see it. Good or bad. It just seems to work for me.

I've been reading this board and talking to you folks for a long time. Only thing is I just didn't post anything. I was the shadow in the background and that buzzing in your ear was me. :D

Anonymous said...

Uncle Ratt.

Please forgive my bad manners. I've been reading this blog for so long that I was sure that you folks could see my shadow and if you had a buzzing in your ear it was me talking to you.

I don't know about intelligent but I do have enough common sense to come in out of the rain. :)

Just an average Joe that is somewhat more vocal than most.

My spelling is terrible but my intentions are good.

Walton aka Cooper

onthestreet said...

Uncle Ratt said (7/20/2006 11:36 AM):
OTS, Welcome back. Why do you have to sneak in as anonymous? Are you ashamed of your identity or did you get kicked off? Again, welcome back Steve.

STREET's Reply: As you can plainly see, even the post you're responding to has been deleted, like all the other recent posts, and I am most thankful.

You shall no more be pruned and digged, but there shall come up briars and thorns.

O Babylon, O Babylon, we bid thee farewell. We're going to the Mountain of Zion to dwell.

ATAR_i said...

giz, you were raised by the LeBaons? Do you tell your story at all in the film?

giz2gaz said...

The producer & narrator for "BANKING ON HEAVEN" was raised in the LeBaron cult. She escaped from Latin America at age 16. She does tell part of her story in the film. It's her voiceover you hear in the trailer. Many of the distributers we've talked to want us to make a film about the LeBarons, with Laurie narrating.

giz2gaz said...

Fundy said
You people who made this movie have no real idea of polygamous life or will you probably ever.

As I've said in other posts here, the producer & narrator for "BANKING ON HEAVEN" was raised in polygamy and lived in Short Creek for a time. She knows as much about polygamy as you do. In addition, we interviewed scores of people both in and out of the FLDS. Polygamy might "work" for the men, but 99% of the women we talked to said it was a miserable & degrading life. It's interesting how the FLDS men always presume to speak for the women, but when the women speak for themselves, a whole new story emerges.

ATAR_i said...

Well fundy, I'm going to have to throw that one back at you - as you claim to know everything about EVERYONE who isn't FLDS. About 'our' divorces, and 'our' everything else you can imagine.

'our' being billions people who live completely and utterly different lives with a plethora of different religions, cultures, ethnicities, nationalities, backgrounds etc etc etc. If those sorts of comments aren't massie over generalization of the highest order then I don't know what one is.

muggsey said...

Ots

Farewell, adeau, au revoir, adios, syanara and good ridance.

giz2gaz said...

Fundy said:
"Standard media hype. come on the FLDS are not having any more problems than people in other religions."

Come again? Maybe the men aren't having any more problems than in other religions, but the women and children sure are. Unless, of course you're talking about the Muslims. They practice polygamy too, and have pretty much the same amounts of abuse, child brides, lost boys, etc. Take a look at recent riots in France & the near collapse of the gov't in the Netherlands these days to see how the polygamist Muslims have completely disrupted society & bled the welfare systems.

I can understand anyone distrusting media hype. But, without seeing the film yourself, how are you able to label it "media hype"? A 73 min. documentary that took 3 years to make really can't be compared to a 3 min. evening news blurb.

ATAR_i said...

giz - did you go to these places then, did you get to see these things. Had you any personal experience with them prior to this film.

I'm curious what it was like for you to dive so deep into this project not coming from this background. I am curious your feelings when it all began, and what it was like for you.

Will you share?

giz2gaz said...

I first saw Colorado City about 12 years ago, when I stopped in the grocery store. I simply couldn't believe my eyes when I saw how the women were dressed. I felt like I'd entered the Twilight Zone, and I felt a little creeped out. I had taken a few courses at Northern Arizona University on Mormon history (taught by the incredible Valeen Tippits Avery), but nothing prepared me for Colorado City.

The strangeness of it all stayed with me, and eventually I decided to make a film about the people there. I'd spent some time with the Amish, and I was curious about how the FLDS compared. The problem, of course, was that the town was virtually closed to outsiders, so it took some inginuity to meet people who were willing to talk to me, to say nothing of being filmed. Building trust was what took most of the 3 years required to complete the film.

There was always the fear factor. My small crew & I were constantly on edge. Every time we made the 5-hour drive to CC, no one said a word the whole way. Most of the time we were sick in the stomach until the shoot was over. We'd been harassed so often, trailed, pursued on the highway to Fredonia, that we were acutely aware of the danger we were in. "BANKING ON HEAVEN" has a "Making Of" feature that shows some of the situations we had to deal with.

It didn't take long for me to realize that this wasn't just some strange sect. I discovered very early on that what the people there were telling me about abuse, banishment & welfare fraud was really true. As I peeled back layer after layer of truth, the story became horrifying. And I guess that's the word that describes my feelings even today.

ATAR_i said...

How interesting, I can hardly wait to see the movie. Did your movie influence any of the people around you - what did they think of it?

giz2gaz said...

Several kinds of audiences have seen the film. People familiar with the FLDS show sadness, sorrow, and often are in tears. One of Warren Jeffs' nephews cried throughout the screening. They've told me that it was terribly painful to see so clearly what they've lived through. It's like deja vu for folks who have witnessed or experienced the abuse.

Other people have never heard of the FLDS, and often haven't a clue as to what Mormons are about. These people gasp audibly throughout the film, laugh out loud at the most clueless politicians, and sometimes even "boo" obvious liars. They're sincerely outraged that this kind of thing is actually happening in America in the 21st century. It's like having the Taliban in our own backyard.

And then there are the non-profit organizations that we show the film to, to try to raise money to help the people in CC get out & and get an education and skills so that they can survive in the world. You probably won't believe this, but every single one of the organizations' directors have refused to show "BANKING ON HEAVEN" to their members because it's too "political". Makes you wonder where their loyalties lie, eh?

My sister, who is a fairly well-known artist and equal rights activist in New York City, showed the film to a dozen of her associates a few months ago. These people knew nothing about Mormons or the FLDS, but their reactions were fast & furious (via tele-conference). "WTF?" was the most common response. They were outraged.

fundy said...

I first saw Colorado City about 12 years ago, when I stopped in the grocery store.

As I peeled back layer after layer of truth, the story became horrifying

You don't have any real means of peeling back anything. Like alot of other people who come to CC you are on the outside and will always remain there. All you have to rely on are people who are disatisfied with the religion and are on their way out. They are the ONLY ones who will talk about it. And are the only ones who go on tv and talk to the media. The ones who are happy with the system are not talking and certainly would not talk to you. That is why coverage of the religion is so one sided.

Yes warren jeffs has basically brought his religion to a point where it is collapsing around them.

Prior to Warren, leadership was good and things went much better.

Things could be turned around with the FLDS is someone stepped in and started taking over.

The problem is lack of good leadership at this point, and will continue untill some one better comes along.

No its not the twilight zone. You have no understanding of what its about and never will.

giz2gaz said...

Fundy said:
All you have to rely on are people who are disatisfied with the religion and are on their way out. They are the ONLY ones who will talk about it.


You're both right & wrong, Fundy . Many people who have been kicked out & others who've escaped talk about their experiences and they say it was truely awful. But there are also true Warrenites who speak their piece. How do you know what's in the film when you've never seen it?

Fundy Said:
"The ones who are happy with the system are not talking and certainly would not talk to you."

Well,Fundy, you're wrong there. You sound like you're totally out of touch with reality, buddy. The women & children who are NOT HAPPY have spoken to me, and on camera. They just want to get away from the predatory men (like you FUNDY?).

Then are the women from Centennial Park. They paint a nice picture of how polygamy works & how all the women love it. The only way to explain their TV Stepford-like faces is to keep in mind that they've ha a lot of PR advice. Would you believe these smiling, anonymous, Cindarella's?

One other thing, Fundy. Why WOULDN'T people in CC talk to me? Could it be because they've been taught that "Outsiders are the agents of Satan"? I have a recorded tape of Warren saying those exact words. How about the "Keep Sweet" signs in every house? That sign, ordered by Warren to be posted in every house, is a direct rebuke to women.

ATAR_i said...

Fundy, it's true that someone who has never been part of your religion will never understand the nuances of relationships, and the voiceless gestures and expectations.

No one can know those things. BUT, the XFLDS, speaking from the outside, who WERE ONCE IN, and DID UNDERSTAND.

Just because their experiences are not optimal, or because they have negative things to say does not mean that they are liars, and their experiences were exceptional.

What it does mean is that they are willing to talk, they are willing to share, they are willing to put a voice to some of the most painful experiences of their lives.

Perhaps for some the motivation is anger - anger at how they were treated. Others might be altruistically motivated and be sincere in their desire to put a word of compassion out there for those who are hurting.

But whatever the motivation, and whatever the circumstances of their departure from FLDS (booted or fled) - they have one thing in common - THEY WERE ON THE INSIDE, THEY DID KNOW THE CULTURE, THE NUANCES, THE INSIDE SCOOPS.

Neither you, nor anyone else can take that away from them

fundy said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
fundy said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ATAR_i said...

NO, I think I'll point out that you tell us we have no idea what we're talking about.

Well again - I'll ask -

WHO ARE THE ENEMIES OF ZION?

Perhaps if someone wasn't such a vortex, they might be able to enlighten us.

P.S. I didn't have to back off that question - but I offered to - and you acted like an absolute schmuck in response.

ATAR_i said...

Fundy

Is this how you win an argument when your intellect, rationale, or lack of reasonable/logical thought fails?

Threatening someone - utter cowardice!

fttc said...

Fundy, that was reprehensible. You are making life threats against this person. You try to distance yourself by saying it will be someone not connected to you. Quit trying to fool anyone. That threat came from you directly. Your threat only adds fuel to the fire. You will not get anyone to go away and leave the fundamentalists alone by actions such as this. The trailer of this movie looks to me like more of the same. Giz must have had a bad experience with the FLDS to put the slant on the film that it has (or seems to have from the trailer). Showing more unkindness to him/her will not change anyone's mind.

Anonymous said...

I saw "BANKING ON HEAVEN" in Vancouver, and the filmmakers didn't put any slant on the film. The beauty of "BANKING ON HEAVEN' is that the film gives all sides, and leaves any final decision-making to the audience. These filmmakers have done a marvelous job.

fundy said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
fundy said...

Colorado City is NOT a safe place for outsiders to by fooling areound with......Never has , Never will be.. Any outsider that goes out there and starts carrying on had better watch out. Such has been the case for a long time.


fttc & atar_1 I am not interested in talking to you, today, tomorrow or ever. GO BOTHER SOMEONE ELSE.

ATAR_i said...

Let me just first thank the blog, for being honored next to such an incredible blogger as fttc, for the prestigious honor of 'panties in a wad' by fundy. I'd also like to thank my parents, and the academy for this wonderful honor, I couldn't have done this without your genes and support.

fundy said...

fttc & atar_1 I am not interested in talking to you, today, tomorrow or ever. GO BOTHER SOMEONE ELSE.

fundy said...

giz2gaz said:
What it does mean is that they are willing to talk, they are willing to share, they are willing to put a voice to some of the most painful experiences of their lives.

Uh UH, no that is just not the case. You have not idea or concept of things in Mormon sects and denomination. You have wasted your time and effort. Colorado City is only one of many sects of Mormon Polygamy. One that is struggling because leadership has let them down. It IS NOT necessarily representative of all the Mormon Sects and denominations out there.

fttc said...

I likewise am honored. It is strange that Atar and I should share this honor being we are from opposite sides of the issue at hand. Strange how evil will unite and bring together those who would otherwise be separated. Congratulations Fundy for the fruits of your labors!

Uncle Ratt said...

Fundy said, "The problem is lack of good leadership at this point, and will continue until some one better comes along."

My question is "Do you believe that Winston Blackmore can provide this good leadership and be able to replace Warren in CC?"

I'm wondering why you are attacking fttc and atar_i so vigorously? This proves to me that you are very insecure in your stand and argument against them. Why do you even want to argue? Arguing never gets anywhere. "We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, praiseworthy, or of good report we seek after these things." If you are as correct in your thinking as you claim to be then why don't you follow this admonition?

ATAR_i said...

Fundy - if you post on this blog, I will reply if I want to.

Your admonitions to the contrary seem childish, or perhaps you just need your testicles to descend.

fundy said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ATAR_i said...

OHhhh so you can respond to me, but I can't respond to you - is that how it works?

Do you object to the word testicle? I mean - this blog is about polygamy - yanno - the stuff porn movies are made of (or so I hear).

Did you just forget that you threatened to have the producer of "Banking on Heaven" SHOT if he came to Colorado City again?

Anyhow - I was merely pointing out your lack of testosterone, when dealing with me. So man up, get some cajones and stop making mountains out of molehills, and answer reasonable questions (which is all I was asking).

Anonymous said...

I believe "cyber threats " are punishable by law. Enforceable Laws.

This blog has a lot of useful information and I would hate to see it shut down because adults can not act like law-abiding adults. IP addy's are traceable.



Cooper aka Walton

ATAR_i said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

Watched the trailer. B.S. is all there is in there. There is an obvious propaganda that I can predict. Only the apostates are telling the truth right? Is that why people gasped? Anybody telling the truth are portrayed as liars, right?

My comments as I watched the trailer:

There were and possibly are abusive men who profess to be FLDS. (A lot fewer now) ABUSE IS NOT Sanctioned by the FLDS. Jack Cook does not represent the FLDS. He was a PUKE!

Chattle? Breeding machines? For welfare money? You really believe that? Bleeding the beast was invented and repeated by liars. Its NOT TRUE!

400 Mil? Buster COME ON!

PENNIE YOU ARE THE ONE TEACHING HATE!


I was there when Warren Jeffs twisted his wife's braid. IT WAS A SKIT! A SLAPSTICK COMEDY! (By the way she got him back later)
Shame on you Jaleena! (Sarah's sister, Dan Fischer's daughter)

The only human rights abuses are the ones you advocate JD

Outsiders are agents of Satan?
B.S.! How do you think we earn a living? Tourists can and have had friendly chats, but bring a camera and a microphone and I will run the other way. Why? because interviews are chopped up and misquoted. Probably done in this film. Reporters, and you filmmakers are obviously agents of Satan.

Dan Fischer, the Taliban? PULEEEZ!

The FLDS believe that abortion is murder, and what Elaine said is a lie of the blackest kind. PUTRID DISGUSTING. All children are loved here.


I LOVE YOU RUTH! May you have peace is my prayer. Your son's love you!

Larie witnessed the Labaron group, not the FLDS.

Pam was not given books? Poor kid, I sure was. Doesn't she looove the camera though.

Human wreckage? Look at your own society!

INCINERATOR? JONESTOWN?(I just threw up)


LIBERATE YOURSELVES FROM THE PROPAGANDA OF THIS FILM!!

The obvious purpose of this film is for money. The wilder the story, the more money you can get. See JD, Krak, MIB and Watkiss. They make their living on propaganda. Worked for them, might work for you. But I hope it fails miserably.

Anonymous said...

To the poster @12:29 am

Can you explain the unmarked graves at Baby graveland?

Can you explain the babies born with deformities?

Can you explain the stats on Welfare recipients from that area?

Can you explain the boys that were told to leave?

Can you explain the un-paid taxes?

Fredonia Friend said...

Also to Anonymous 12:29 am

Could you also explain why some parents that follow Warren have allowed their children to be sent to YFZ without them? Would you allow your kids to go without you? If so, do you have children there now, and do you plan to join them soon?

giz2gaz said...

Anonymous said...
Watched the trailer. B.S. is all there is in there

Thanks for your review. Has anyone else seen the trailer (bankingonheaven.com)? Do you agree wth anonymous? Any opinins?

ATAR_i said...

I watched the trailer. Ruth does a great job - the trailer is quite good. I really want to see the movie. I'm going to have to remember to go there and buy the movie.

Has anyone seen the whole thing? Is it as good as the trailer makes it seem?

From what I hear, she doesn't have any visituation with her children, why is her legal access to her children such that she cannot see them?

giz2gaz said...

Thanks for your feedback, Atari. I'm particularly pleased that you liked Ruth. Her story is really complicated and was very hard to tell honestly & without bias. From the day I first met Ruth, she struck me as a dynamic and fearless woman. I wanted to show that in the film. Many, many people who have seen the film have said that they fell in love with Ruth.

So far, the info I've gotten back from the people who are actually in the film is that they are impressed with the lack of sensationalism, even though the story is horrifying. People who are still inside or have left CC have said 100% of the time that the story is accurately told. I'm not bragging; just passing on info to date.

fundy said...

LIBERATE YOURSELVES FROM THE PROPAGANDA OF THIS FILM!!

I agree, media propaganda. They should go stick their nose in some where else.

giz2gaz said...

Yes, liberate yourselves from the TRUTH all ye faithful Warrenites! Watch the film and make up your own minds!

fundy said...
They should go stick their nose in some where else.

Well, Fundy, in fact we are. You and your fellow Warrenites will be totally amazed at the next film about the abuses of the FLDS.

Anonymous said...

Fundy,
You my dear are not what you claim to be.

Although I am interested as to WHY you claim to be of FLDS background.

Walton aka Cooper

Anonymous said...

giz-
Why would we want to liberate ourselves from the truth? Just because you have?

"go buy the film and see for yourself"

gunna make you rich, right?
Just watching the trailer made me puke.

Lack of sensationalism? PULEEZE! This film represents the FLDS as well as Jerry Springer, or Maury Povich represent American ideals.

By the way, did you know that Ruth was once a regular poster on this blog?

fundy said...

Warren Jeffs is a complete and utter failure, who should be replaced by someone who knows what he is doing. Need to put a someone else in charge and quickly. This is about a religion that is failing. It has worked in the past. However it is most definetly about failure of leadership. And even more than that, it is a people who have turned their back on the Almighty. And are now are paying a big price for that. It is a story of a Covenant people who have broken their Covenants with the Almighty and are now reaping the curse that comes with turning from Him.

ATAR_i said...

I think Ruth is the one part of the story that truly shows how hard it is.

She's definately not retarded or dumb by any stretch of the imagination. She's strong and resourceful. She's also amazingly pretty - she has great features!

But you see the internal struggles, hurt by FLDS, hurt by CPS, understanding weaknesses, but still wanting to get her heritage back. Unwilling to give in.

I personally think someone should get in there and sign Ruth up for a book, so she can make some money. Her personality is amazing - her perspectives unique. Someone should also help her get those kids back - she's not crazy!

I hope you capture all that in the film, I can see bits of it in the trailer, and I've heard her story before. I'm certain you did her justice - but I can hardly wait to see.

Fredonia Friend said...

Ruth also has an amazing gift for writing poetry. I wish her all the best as she deals with her struggles.

Anonymous said...

I replied to those two with questions about my post 12:29 but I guess the Admin didnt like it.

giz2gaz said...

And Ruth sings like an angel! Wait till you hear her in the film!

ATAR_i said...

Yes, I saw on another blog she had an address to send monies to, and she would write you a poem. I know someone who is looking for an original poem. I wish Ruth would post that information again.

Fredonia Friend said...

Me too. Desert Darling and Uncle Ratt - assuming you both know Ruth, have you seen her lately?

Uncle Ratt said...

The last I knew she was living in CC in the little cinderblock house that Esther once lived in.

ATAR_i said...

Can you ask her if she still writes poetry freelance?

onthestreet said...

The time comes when saints just want to hide up in the Lord, and forever be done with the world and its universal abuse.

ATAR_i said...

Ruth - do you still write poetry freelance?

Anonymous said...

A great sadness is that Val Jessop used the children and played on Laurene Jessop's guilt to get her to come back. Even though Laurene feels things are working out, she is still living with a man who is married to another woman. He never divorced Marie and prides himself in having control of Laurene again. Laurene's strength has crumbled in favor of a man's pride, she even sounds like her spiritual husband now when she defends herself.

Think about it said...

Curious... if Short Creek is such a secret society, then how did they get the cameras in? Think about that one.