Friday, August 19, 2005

So What if Warren Jeffs gets Caught??

Warren Jeffs is a victim. He just took advantage of a society ready for the picking. Even if he is gone--the fanaticism is still there. A "closed" society that protects their women and children from reality..soon lacks common sense.

115 comments:

Anonymous said...

Even back in the '53 raid, many of the Zittings, Dargers, Barlows, Johnsons that chose a different route were shunned and forgot.

This has been going on forever with the "priesthood" work. It happened with the "Mormon" church. They excummunicated Rulon Jeffs and took his wife Zola from him at least 40 years ago.

rumor-has-it said...

Even if Warren Jeffs gets caught..the next in line Lyle Jeffs, Will Timpson, Willy Jessop, Merril Jessop, Sam Barlow, Jerold Williams are more fanatical than Warren and they aren't "scitz".

Then what?

Anonymous said...

Don't forget Uncle Wendell, we have not seen anything yet.

Anonymous said...

"Took his wife Zola from him"?

It sounds to me like she did what most women would do when he said that he would be bringing in another wife to join them, and that he was abandoning everything that she knew to be true.

I suppose that technically, yes, the LDS church did excommunicate him. But he is the one that left the church.

mugwump said...

If you know who your enemies are and don't do anything to stop them who do you have to blame but yourselves?

Why do you stand aside and allow the "nuts" to gain power. If an election was held, would they be the ones elected if the FLDS had a choice and the elections were overseen by neutral (non-mormon) authorities?

Just wondering how you keep getting in hot water and reconcile the fact that you can do nothing about it.

The thirteen colonies of the British, in North America, declared and then won their independence from the most mighty nation on the planet. Those thirteen colonies became The United States of America.

If you want to keep doing kooky things, just elect kooky leaders. Why should the order of leadership remain static. Throw the bums out. Let them learn to work for a living and quit making your lives so miserable. It's your choice. It's time for a NEW order of things in
FLDS.

Are you just going to roll over and play dead? Who are they going to rule if you turn your backs on them and tell them to shove off, the free lunch is over. They have squandered your people, your women, your children and your money. Learn from mistakes and move on to better things.

Anonymous said...

"Why do you stand aside and allow the 'nuts' to gain power?"

I dunno.

Why do we stand aside and allow a nut like Mugwump to take ove the blog and run roughshod over the place like he/she/it owns it?

I dunno.

Maybe we're just too polite for our own good.

Anonymous said...

So, Mugwump....

Do you propose that ALL churches have to have secret ballot elections overseen by Amnesty International and Jimmy Carter the nut-farmer?

Anonymous said...

I vote Mugwump for Warren's next bride.

mugwump said...

Did I say anything about churches holding elections? I thought that the people were the most important personages in the USA. Has Mormonism replaced the right of the people to hold free elections?

Don't mess up the jurisdictions.

The state (government in any form)has it's responsabilities.

The church, independent of the state, has it's responsabilities.

We have two issues here:

1. The political problems associated with a church being in control of all property and tax revenues. Is this the proper understanding of the separation of Church and State?

2. The theological problems of assuming that leaders of the church have the unrestricted authority over the political aspects of a society. Is this separation of Church and State?

Which should rule?

Under U.S. law no state or any other government shall be dominated by a church and it's heiarchy.

Under U.S. law no church shall be dominated by state or federal authority.

No state church shall be established and no church state is permited.

The state is not in the church business and the church should not be in the "state" business.

This is not confusing to those of us who live away from every aspect of life being dictated by a church dominated government.

With the evidence of corruption becoming available to you regarding control of both your UEF and in the operation of the Colorado City, USD your problem is very apparent. The whole thing looks rather suspicious. Where there is smoke, there usually is fire. Had you rather breathe the smoke or fight the fire?

A soul said...

Thank-you Mugwump;I thought that your 5:27 posting was very nicely put.

Anonymous said...

Separation between church and state never existed in Colorado City,hence all
the present woes.I hate to admit it,But I dont think it will ever.If elections are held the sheeple would only vote however they are told.this was the real reason,19th century Mormons were driven
from 3 states,Utah was only granted statehood after LDS was driven to abandon Theocracy.I would be curiuos to know what the percentage of residents of Colorado City/Hildale are still under the profits control.

Anonymous said...

mugwump said...

The state is not in the church business and the church should not be in the "state" business.

That's only true if you don't live in Utah. Utah is not a state in the USA, Utah is a theocracy run by the LDS Church.

onthestreet said...

"God's ways are not man's ways." The Priesthood, Church, and Kingdom of God are three entities in one, in the Kingdom of Heaven.
There are daily elections, and the people elect vox dei, vox populi. Just because you all hate that, doesn't mean that the FLDS do.

John 15:

Jesus' love for his disciples (15:1-17) is now contrasted with the world's hatred of Jesus and his disciples. Jesus has confronted his opponents repeatedly with the fact that their rejection of him reveals their alienation from God. Now Jesus says that their alienation will lead them to reject his disciples as well.Jesus Explains the Source of the World's Hatred of His Disciples (15:18-25) Jesus relates what he has experienced to what the disciples will now experience (vv. 18-20). The rejection of Jesus by his opponents has been based in their alienation from God. Jesus now refers to them as the world, since the world is that which is in rebellion against God. The disciples would face rejection by Gentiles as well (cf. Tacitus Annals 15.44; Suetonius Nero 16), but at the moment Jesus has Jewish opposition in mind (16:2). Since the disciples are members of Christ like branches are members of a vine, they receive what he receives--both the sunshine and rain of the love of the Father and the storms of the hatred of those who are in rebellion against the Father.

15:1
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

15:2
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

15:3
Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

15:4
Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

15:5
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

15:6
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

15:7
If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

15:8
Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

15:9
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

15:11
These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

15:12
This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

15:13
Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

15:14
Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

15:15
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

15:16
Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

15:17
These things I command you, that ye love one another.

15:18
If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

15:19
If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

15:20
Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.

15:21
But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.

15:22
If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin.

15:23
He that hateth me hateth my Father also.
"

ATAR_i said...

I kinda like this one better. Its about how we act towards others, not how others act towards us. How we act is something WE control - that we have an active part in. HOW OTHERS TREAT US IS NOT AN INDICATOR OF OUR CHARACTER AS MUCH AS HOW WE TREAT OTHERS

Mathew 25:39-41

39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Merycia said...

Very good point, Atar_i.

"How others treat us is not an indicator of our character as much as how we treat others."

Richard said...

Gail and Brandon Blackmore live in Canada, and are supporters of
Warren. I am a friend of Gail's Father. My friend heard that two of
Gail's daughters were married to Warren. I would like to confirm
this, and learn their first names. Gail has long refused to
communicate with her father-- on FLDS orders I am sure.

My friend would also like to know the whereabouts of these two
daughters (his granddaughers) if in fact they are married to Jeffs.

I realize such information is hard to come by. Anyone is welcome to email me directly if they have any information about this:

erichard@direcway.com

Richard

mugwump said...

So Utah is a clandistine operation, at odds with the rest of America. If this is so, why do you have representatives in the US House, senators in the Senate? Why do you have Federal Courts and above all, why do you have the right to access any tax dollars generated within the U.S.A?

If you want a theocracy, then get your hand out of my pocket, and don't expect any help when you get into trouble. You've been taking U.S. largess for years, but it's time to move the milk cow, that carries our brand, out of your barn and give her to one of the states who remain loyal, just as the master did to the disloyal servent in the parable of the talents.

Thrash me all you want. Your ignorance of your rights and fear to stand up for those rights is the reason I am making these postings.
(Proverbs 21:22) A wise man scaleth the city of the mighty, and casteth down the strength of the confidence thereof.(KJV)

I'm throwing the common citizen a lifline to escape their bonds of slavery. I am beginning to believe the only ones who reply to my efforts are those who are called massa'.

Anonymous said...

Well, Streetie, Question? How does one repent and come back into the WARREN'S FOLD!

Warren kicks out, but does Warren (false teacher) ever FORGIVES!

Onewaystreet

PS... JOHN 15:14
Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Somehow Streetie, I get the impression HIS FOLLOWERS should put (Warren's name in the (I) spot.

And onthestreet said...
"God's ways are not man's ways." The Priesthood, Church, and Kingdom of God are three entities in one, in the Kingdom of Heaven."

TRUTH...Onewaystreet said..."God's ways are not man's way." God the Father, God the Son, and God The Holy Spirit are three entities in one, in the Kingdom of Heaven."

onthestreet said...

Ahh, but how do you interpret the "ONE"? Is he three men in one, one man in three? Truth be known, it is ALL THINGS in one, and one in all. Permute it: Noe, Oen (own). This ought to give you some hint.

ATAR_i said...

what the heck kinda theology is that?

one = noe = oen = own

you can permute any word you want and twist it any which way you like - doesn't make it truth.

just more hink pink streetology

onthestreet said...

RIGHT! And that MAKES IT truth, for there is a certain peculiar light in every letter, and as long as the key letters are present, you've got the same light in various arrangements, or strings of energy.

Take our example: ONE
Now, in permutation you get NO and OWN. Thus, to be one people and one with God, is to be OWNED by him and to have NO other alterior motives diverse from Him, SEE!

Now, for "TWISTED" truth, that is the helix, the alef, the first. The dna is a twisted helix. Understand?

onthestreet said...

That is the flaming sword, at the cellular level.

onthestreet said...

DNAComputer Model of the DNA Helix. Despite what you may have seen in some textbooks, ... The helix, or spiral, is an inherent feature of the DNA molecule. ...
www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/glossary/gloss3/dna.html

onthestreet said...

It is to own all, and to have nothing: All things in common, FLDS Style.

Acts 2:44 All who believed were together, and had all things common; (ASV) And all those who were of the faith kept together, and had all things in common; (BBE) ...bible.cc/acts/2-44.htm

ATAR_i said...

No, mixing letter on words up means nothing. But it sure adds new light to where you get some of your permuted hink pink streetology.

Faithful Woman said...

own all?
It is the use of anything that makes the difference. There is sure no balance to the use of assets in warren's regime.

Anonymous said...

Warren's latest location?

One half of a telephone conversation was recently overheard between a mother and her son (believed to be one of Warren's bodyguards)wherein the location of the son was disclosed. The mother asked,"So is your brother in Denver with you?"

If two of Warren's bodyguards are/were in Denver, then perhaps Warren was/is there as well.

ATAR_i said...

What's in Denver? Does someone have property or is there an FLDS group?

Anonymous said...

To Rumor has it

I heard that your husband has been going around and telling all of the kids that have left the creek, to not talk with any government officials and to not help them in anyway. Is this true?

rumor-has-it said...

I doubt it... the three I know can make their own decisions as to who they want to talk to and help, just like I can.

And as you know, the government has been an object of scorn for many years with the FLDS. Warren Jeffs has been in power for 6 years now and many of the kids I know are 16...and have been indoctrinated for 1/2 their lifetime.

You try to have a decent conversation with them. Most 18 yr olds have a education level of 4th grade. And they see no reason they should learn anything new as long as they can have a car to drive and a bed to sleep in.

rumor-has-it said...

If I could get any message to kids that have left the creek it would be to get an education. Travel and see the world. Don't waste your time on drinking and drugs. Get a Library card and Read, Read, Read. There are many people who have been right where you are at and have had a successful life.
If you can't read, get some books on tape or cd. And learn how to read.

If someone puts their hand out and offers to help you with a room and food, if you will get an education. Do it. It is hard to make a living and get an education. Many people do it though.

Anonymous said...

Well who are Warren's bodyguards?
I know of one Willy Jessop, who else?

Anonymous said...

I think that Warren's own people will reject him if he's left alone, whereas if he's caught, arrested, and imprisoned, it will take a lot longer for his people to figure out that he's human and quit worshipping him.

Anonymous said...

I AGREE! As one who was raised there, I can tell you that the mentality is that as long as he is being "persecuted" then that just proves that he is god's servant. If he was never arrested and interest in him just died down, it would do his victims a world of good.

Faithful Woman said...

I agree that he will have to hang himself in his people's eyes or they will never give him up. They are way too involved.

afp763389 said...

... :(

onthestreet said...

More like his enemies, the enemies of God, hanging themselves. With all the terror and abortion and epidemics going on, as well as the numerous acts of God, it is well underway.

mugwump said...

"Let him that is without sin first cast a stone."

onthestreet said...

Yes, that's it. God is casting stones, for He is a God of war.

Anonymous said...

Newbie but : Who is OTS? He/She is a brain washed loser!! Schizophrenia must be contagious.

onthestreet said...

That's it. You'll catch the spirit.

fttc said...

Georgia

I don't believe for a minute that any of the groups in the east are helping warren. Nor do I believe he would ask. He is too far above them in his mind.

mugwump said...

ots

It gets tiresome stating anything in simple direct english and having you attempt to rearrange the meaning to fit your warped sense of logic and direction.

The meaning of my previous post is this: If you are SINLESS and only IF you are SINLESS are you permitted to cast a stone that those you are accusing. KISS

(keep it simple, stupid)

fttc said...

Those who have not dealt directly with someone who is schizophrenic may be able to see through street what family and associations deal with on a daily basis. I have lived around several people afflicted in this way. To say it is frustrating to try to communicate with them is a severe understatement. It is pointless to try to talk sense to them.

Street often gives something to talk about when things get stagnant, but his input is not good for much else. Pity him, he needs it!

mugwump said...

Thank you fttc for your coveted insight. I hae really enjoyed exchanging beliefs and customs with you and respect your intelligence and ability to discern.

God Bless

fttc said...

Thank you mugwump. I too have enjoyed the exchange.

A challenge to what a person believes is good for the soul.

A different perspective broadens the mind.

An intelligent exchange makes a friend.

onthestreet said...

Muggy (8/25/2005 11:00 AM)
I thought you had expired. Yes, it is very tiring when you rearrange and mug things up. I agree. Now my boy, you saying that you are sinless, and therefore you may cast stones?

Woe: What about the Word? ALL HAVE SINNED, says the Lord. Then to kiss after boasting of accusing, the accuser of the brethren stands before the throne day and night. That is the place of a devil.

And then that kiss of betrayal, Judas like, you having been close to the FLDS for awhile now, even a stone's throw away. You are invited to keep the Bernard-Dog kiss to yourself.

Now, that's pretty simple, yes?

fttc (8/25/2005 1:16 PM): Aint you Flora??? Floral-Mess, take another guess. Talk about schizophrenic, you were taking drugs, stripping, and drinking alot of alcohol for quite awhile. I know that's been covered on the forums. How you doing lately? I hope you're doing better.

However, I think Muggy's real muggy in saying that he "covets" you (8/25/2005 2:50 PM), for whatever dark reason. But then, your are right in saying:

A challenge to what a person believes is good for the soul.

A different perspective broadens the mind.

An intelligent exchange makes a friend. 8/25/2005 11:37 PM

I like that, and so true.

fttc said...

Nice try street.

I don't even personally know Flora. I have never used illegal drugs. I have not even tasted an alcoholic beverage in my life. I have never been a stripper. And not one of these things are a sign of schizophrenia.

You give yourself away when the only way you can defend yourself is by throwing out false accusations to try to discredit your critics.

The truth hurts the worst. That is why you attack the messenger and ignore the message.

feralfem said...

fttc,

Thos last two points in the above post:

How very true. Couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks!

onthestreet said...

Yah, I could have mistook you for Flora. But it's a valid point. It makes one wonder why you admit mingling with schizophrenics, and then you demonstrate personal schizophrenia by getting all paranoid about "changes" in that "WHAT HAS WARREN CHANGED" thread. Let me remind you (8/09/2005 11:40 PM):

NO COVENANTS IN HEAVEN: Everyone made covenants, even the devil.

MARRIAGE AGE: Well now, since many of our own mothers were married at age 14, 15, 16, back in the 30,'s, 40's, 50's, that hasn't changed either. Also, it is the ancient custom that goes back thousands of years, what the Jews call the Bat Mitzvah, or womanhood at age 12.

MARRIAGE WITHOUT PARENTS KNOWLEDGE: "Who is thy mother, or thy father, or they brother," said the Lord, when he was told his "mother" was waiting.

INSTANT DIVORCES with no input from husband: Who is thy husband, when he violates his vow?

NO RECREATION: "Let thy pleasures be in the Lord."

NO SOCIALIZING: "Come out of her, and be not partakers of her sins."

NO MEETINGS except for work assignment: "If you reject me, I will reject you, and will no more visit you," says the Lord. Also: (Mk. 14:25) Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God. And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives. And Jesus saith unto them, All ye shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered.

KICKOUTS WITHOUT TRIAL or at least letting one know the offense: The prophets have always said: "You know when you've done wrong." Also, to go to trial and wrangle about it within the Church, is to lose the Spirit of God or the spirit of peace in what is holy. The House of God is not to be defiled.

ORGANIZATION OF A CHURCH: "We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.

LOCATION OF ZION: All of America is Zion: D&C Lesson 12 “THE GATHERING OF MY PEOPLE” All of America is Zion: “The whole of America is Zion itself from north to south,and is described by the prophets, who declare that it is the Zion where...
www.duanescrowther.com/D_C_12-Gathering.PDF

All of America is Zion: “The whole of America is Zion itself from north to south, and is described
by the prophets, who declare that it is the Zion where the mountain of the Lord should be, and that it
should be in the center of the land. When elders shall take up and examine the old prophecies in
the Bible, they will see it. [HC 6:318-19; Burton: Discourses of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 188]

NO NEED TO PAY DEBTS because end is imminent: I personally never heard him say it. Yet, "Forgive us our Debts, as we forgive our debtors."

Time to Forgive Debts: Forgiving debts is not a new idea; in fact, it’s part of God’s age-old answer to the injustice and inequality of capitalism. The Law of Moses calls forJews ...www.bruderhof.com/articles/debt-forgiveness.htm

BBC NEWS | Politics | Election 2005 | Parties vow to end world poverty. It is wrong that the burden of debts of the past should prevent the poorest ... It was in the country's national interest to end world poverty because...
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/vote_2005/frontpage/4477741.stm

BUILDING TEMPLE: The Jews and the Mormons have ALWAYS been a temple-building people. The whole world knows that.

DC 109

... endured many trials and hardships in order to build a house for the Lord. ... Two other revelations from the Doctrine and Covenants transpose the verbs ...
www.gospeldoctrine.com/ DoctrineandCovenants/DC%20109.htm - 91k - Cached - Similar pages
STUDIES IN SAMUEL No. 47

... is David's proposal to build a "house" for the Lord and the Lord's far more ... That is typical of the way in which the Bible teaches its doctrine. ...
www.faithtacoma.org/sermons/ II.Samuel/Samuel.No.47.II_Samuel_7.1-29.htm

ATAR_i said...

I think Jesus put how you act with government at it's propper level when the tax collectors came. The same tax is not taken in each country, but it happens to be taken in Caesars. So, you give him the things that are his (that he's asking of this world).

So, each government might be slightly different fromt he rest. The Canadians want more money in taxes for their socialized medicine. In the US perhaps slightly less in some areas, slightly more in others. Give it to them.

But it's not just about taxes, it's about laws. You live here, obey the laws. You live somewhere else - obey their laws.

It just won't work to use the rationale that it's ok because your obeying the laws of another country or another century.

The good news is. Everyone who is accountable for causing others to stumble and fall, will be accounted for. So, if your forcing girls into marriages - you're accountable, and God will take pity on the young. If you're seperating up husbands and wives and reassigning them (you're going to be accountable).

God is just. Even so, I would not want my children to suffer on earth so the perpetrators could be judged in heaven. As a parent and a wife I wouldn't stand by and watch it happen. I know that is easier said than done - and I might not have been able to do it a decade ago. But today I can.

fttc said...

Street

In your last post above you have defied the teachings of warren. You have defied the laws of the church as defined in the D&C. You have twisted and turned and snaked around the truth to the point that I will not waste my time with a rebuttal.

I will say there is difference between paranoia and wanting to wake some people up to what is going on around them. Warren and his followers are not a threat to me. If you want to continue to beleive lies even after it has been shown to you that they are lies, more power to you. I will not attempt to take that right away from you. None are so blind as those who will not see.

onthestreet said...

Ditto. Bingo. Eureka. No rebuttal, no defense, and no vision for those whio will not see. Tired yet, or are you just going to issue more rebuttals after saying you simply won't do it?

onthestreet said...

Finally, every knows that the Prophet has changed nothing, but in fact has expanded the Work of God, even with fewer people, making it more mean and lean.

"And I the Lord will rule the nations with an iron hand."

fttc said...

And his work will continue to involve fewer and fewer until it sinks into oblivion like all other imposters in history.

onthestreet said...

See! You're getting it. It is a purification process, and even "Heaven and earth shall pass away". It all comes down to one man after all, doesn't it.

The FLDS One-Man Doctrine PROVEN even by the world itself.

mugwump said...

As an outsider I think I can be objective and say firmly that I think fttc is right on target. OTS speaks with a forked tongue. His and WJ's control would be a putrification process. The only problem is how do you make something that is rotten stink worse than it does?

onthestreet said...

Oh, purification sure does raise a stink, be assured. Then, all that is left is pure sweetness.

ATAR_i said...

putrefation and purification may look similar - but they are not. Which might be why your in such deep doo doo street - you just can't tell the difference.

Anonymous said...

Richard:
As far as I know, only one of Gail's daughters are married to Warren. Her name is Anna Mae after Brandon's mother.She's a very sweet girl.I have no idea where she is now.Goldie,Gail's second daughter is a first wife and seems to be very happy.She doesn't have any more girls anywhere near old enough to be married.

onthestreet said...

Deep doo doo?
8/28/2005 9:36 AM

Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

These are very difficult and hard issues for many. The PURIFICATION CONTINUES: earthquakes, hurricanes, tsunamis, disease, abortion, famine, wars, joblessness, homelessness, starvation, plagues, and terrorism on every side. Many things are happening in the world. Woe to all who keep on mocking God. The purification will arrive all over the earth until the consumption decreed: For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, {yet} a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness..
kcm.co.kr/bible/kjv/isa10.html
D&C:87:

1. VERILY, thus saith the Lord concerning the wars that will shortly come to pass, beginning at the rebellion of South Carolina, which will eventually terminate in the death and misery of many souls;

2. And the time will come that war will be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place.

3. For behold, the Southern States shall be divided against the Northern States, and the Southern States will call on other nations, even the nation of Great Britain, as it is called, and they shall also call upon other nations, in order to defend themselves against other nations; and then war shall be poured out upon all nations.

4. And it shall come to pass, after many days, slaves shall rise up against their masters, who shall be marshaled and disciplined for war.

5. And it shall come to pass also that the remnants who are left of the land will marshal themselves, and shall become exceedingly angry, and shall vex the Gentiles with a sore vexation.

6. And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the CONSUMPTION DECREED hath made a full end of all nations,

7. That the cry of the saints, and the blood of the saints, shall cease to come up into the ears of the Lord of Sabaoth, from the earth, to be avenged of their enemies.

8. Wherefore, stand ye in holy places, and be not moved, until the day of the Lord come; for behold, it cometh quickly, saith the Lord. Amen.

ATAR_i said...

Your quoting words you believe to be divine that I DON'T believe to be divine. Better luck next time.

onthestreet said...

Unbelief and Ignorance of the True Law is no excuse for violating it. Judgement still comes.

onthestreet said...

Today a hurricane, tomorrow this, the next day that, "until the consumption decreed".

Anonymous said...

An intelligent exchange makes a friend. 8/25/2005 11:37 PM
I like that, and so true.
********
It's no wonder you don't have any friends Street.

onthestreet said...

In here, you're probably right.

Anonymous said...

I don't understand why on the steet continously quotes from a book he claims is authentic scripture.

Why would you need to continously use the word verily when the word truthfully means exacty the same thing. Whether, thether, thee and thou are not holy words. They are simply examples of the language that was in common use amond intellectuals at the time the translation was given to the publisher to print.

I believe that this language difference confuses a lot of people. If God's word is to be presented to the common man, for his good, why use antiquated language?

onthestreet said...

Woe unto THEE, for THINE is the error, THOU hypocrit.

mugwump said...

ots: who are you quoting now, Bugs Bunny?

onthestreet said...

So it is, if it bugs your bunns, or fails to tickle your fanny (I mean, fancy).

mugwump said...

straight out of bots lexicon of idiotic nonsense.

onthestreet said...

Ahh, on the Street called Straight, the wicked term all that comes from God as idiotic and nonsence, having eyes to see and ears to hear, but sensing not. Hense, NON-SENSE.

I only used modern terminology to describe someone who doesn't respond well to anything that doesn't appeal to their gross outer senses, vs the Insense of Acceptance at the Altar of Insense. To you, it is "idiotic," yes?

mugwump said...

bots

It is not my place, nor yours, to judge mankind. That responsabilit beongs to the Lord jesus Christ.

I have seen friendships, marrriages, and congregations torn apart because of some "holier than thou" individual proclaiming that they are the only one to have reeived a blessing of God. How would we know that that expression was the truth?

I have found that most often, praise for having found "the truth" is the sum of these folks exercise. They seek to have a higher place in honor than others. Up like a rocket, down like a rock.

Attention to the Word makes an individual studious, more humble, more thoughtful, be able to develop an ability to become discern and suggest a right or better approach to cause the "sinner" to judge for himself, under the conviction of the HOLY SPIRIT, of their sinful nature and their need to confess and repent.

Let God be God. I can't one-up HIM.

onthestreet said...

Mug (9/01/2005 11:03 AM):

Not for us to judge??? Let's look at the Word of the Lord: Prov. 31:9. Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.

Deut. 1:16: And I charged your judges at that time, saying, Hear the causes between your brethren, and judge righteously between every man and his brother.

(1 Sam 16:7 KJV) But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his ...
... we can judge righteously that the person is committing sin because of the word of...(John 7:24 KJV) Judge not according to the appearance, but judge ...

Luke 7:43: And the Lord Jesus said unto him: "Thou hast rightly judged."

Luke 12:56, 57: Ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky and of the earth; but how is it that ye do not discern this time? Yea, and why even of yourselves judge ye not what is right? IE: Why do you not judge, for we are commanded to judge, but not in a way that you would not want to be judged. Thus the saying: "Judge not, THAT YE BE NOT JUDGED", or in a way that you wouldn't want to be judged. Can you imagine nobody utilizing their judgement. You say, "It is not my place to judge". That is so true, for you do not judge rightly. However, when you do, it is your place.

Now, as for friendships, marriages, congregations torn apart because of holiness:
Matt 10:34-42: Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me. He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward. And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.

You Say: The FLDS seek to have a higher place in honor than others. Well IF YOU DON'T go higher (even to God on the highest), by obedience to the law that endows you to do that, where are you? You're lower, not by our doing but by your own. The Saints of the Most High are not that, if they are not Most High.

Daniel 7:18 But the saints of the Most High shall receive

(KJV) But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever. (WBS) ...
bible.cc/daniel/7-18.htm

You say: Let God be God. I can't one-up HIM. No, but you can join him. If you are not with him, you are against him.

mugwump said...

Well, perhaps in your case a little judgement is in order.

I just sew the seed. God reaps the harvest.

When I see your little world I see a baren spiritual wasteland and I want no part of it.

onthestreet said...

You couldn't have it if you wanted it. You are shut out, because of the seed you sew:

Mt.13:3. And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;

4. And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:

5. Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:

6. And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.

7. And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:

mugwump said...

Your comment omits one very important ingredient. You say I sew the "wrong seed." I can not find any reference to the quality of seed in the text you quoted as being my contribution.

You know nothing of "seed of the spirit" of the Living God. Since I don't attempt to make up my own scripture, but copy from the Bible, and not from some work of a delusional fraud, you don't know the difference.

You remind me of the two brothers planting a garden in the movie,"Second Hand Lions". They opened the seed package, planted the contents thereof, hung the seed packet at the end of the row and were totaly in awe of the fact that corn grew in each row. They didn't recognize the difference between the various seed. You would do well to take your seed to a representative of the U.S. Department of Agriculture thereby determining just what it is you are planting. I doubt that anyone whom you revere will be able to discern the difference any better than you do.

onthestreet said...

By their fruits...

mugwump said...

Yep! and I'm nothing but a fruit inspector. If you don't like the scrutiny, quit being such a fruitcake.

onthestreet said...

By their fruits...

mugwump said...

nuf sed, nuf times. don't understand, ain't gonna' repeat.

onthestreet said...

Fine confession. And how can you come to understanding?

mugwump said...

shut up and listen.

onthestreet said...

That's it! "Be still, and know that I am God".

mugwump said...

Only to your reflection in a mirror.

onthestreet said...

That's so right, my friend. Some are created after the image of God, and if you don't LISTEN to that still voice within, you don't get it. You're coming. Keep trying.

mugwump said...

I've been listening and following for over 50 years. Be careful and test the spirits. Has your prophet always told the 100% truth? You said that you were a student at Alta Academy. I'll bet you know that the carges and defaulted judgements against Jeffs related to his having sodomized his nephew are the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Boy, he sounds like a really great role model to inspire respect and honor. If you were a loving, caring parent would you want to leave your young children in his care? Tell the truth now.

Maybe you're into child abuse too!

Do you think that children who are being abused are receiving a lesson from God?

My God is Love.

From the charges and indictments facing Jeffs, he doesn't know any more about love than a rattlesnake.

onthestreet said...

WUMP (9/06/2005 6:58 PM): You really need to go to social security (what little you have left), and change your birth-name. It is so similar to WIMP, and RUMP, and the image that you have taken by your own choosing, and thus born with.

As for your post: You may have been listening for 50-years, but to whom? We must test the spirits alright, and if you continue to reveal a spirit of hate and unrest about the FLDS or anything else, it is NOT the Spirit of God. For the Spirit of God is the Spirit of Peace. The Prophet has ALWAYS told 100% truth, as the Prophet of God. Yes, I AM a student of the Alta, and I KNOW that he world always has, and always will bring railing accusations against saints,angels, and even God himself, and will even curse God and die. It is so prophesied, and its fulfillment has begun. The only sodomizers are those who seek to cast their own crimes and propensities upon the favorites of heaven, for the trial of the faith, and to seal their own fate.

Yes, the prophet is a REALLY GOOD ROLE MODEL, to the virgins who are accepted into the wedding feast, and quite the opposite to unwise virgins and non-virgins alike. Yes, I am loving and caring, and leave the children in his care, where they are safer than anywhere else on earth. Your accepted and legal practice of raping your women in the name of luv and marage, and MURDERING their offspring in the name of choice, is where the ABUSE OF CHILDREN thrives to the maximum. Now there is where children are in THE MOST DANGER.Your God is Satan, simple as that. From the charges and indictments facing YOU from above, you do know, and will be among those cursing God and dying. We can only lament in lamentation for your soul.

mugwump said...

If you would concentrate on the defense of your indefensable position instead of worrying about my pseudonym you would appear to be a more rational individual.

onthestreet said...

Ahh, but Muggy is Muggy is Muggy, from the crown of your head, to your rump, to the souls of your feet. Then, being Muggy, or incoherent without any clarity, makes the rump as much a wimp, as the wimp is a rump. That's is a very concentrated fact, and very rational.

ATAR_i said...

ok streety that's just plain odd.

mugwump said...

ots

your 2:49 post makes the point regarding incoherency without additional comment.

onthestreet said...

Ahh, additional comment indeed. I shall oblige. You see, when you plug up a conduit, there is no flow. When you break the contact with the heavens through regular succession, there is no energy. When you block the light, there is only darkness. Then there is no strength, but only the weak conditions of a wimp, no standing on your feet but only on your rump, and very muggy in your conception of truth and light.

ATAR_i said...

You make no sense.

mugwump said...

Are you admiting to being constipated?

You have demonstrated your ability to bloviate, and flatuate. I guess you have only so much capacity so the gas has to go in one of two directions or you would explode.

onthestreet said...

Your own heart and mind are spilling over with the corruption that is in them. Just clean it up.

ATAR_i said...

ots - you speak from experience on that matter.

mugwump said...

install a pressure sensitive "pop-valve"

onthestreet said...

lol: Yes, very exposive, and it shall cover the earth. No pop-valve or cork in your behind can handle the pressure. That will have to do for your champaign when you celebrate your perceived
"victories" in sin.

mugwump said...

Any victories I experience will be because of the love of Jesus not the pronouncement of a voice of lunacy.

onthestreet said...

Yes, he loves you, like a mother who powders a baby's diaper, while you goo goo at the moon instead of protecting the issues of life. That being the lunar globe, you certainly experience lunacy.

mugwump said...

No, He loves me as only God can. I don't think that you have experienced that event in your life.

onthestreet said...

"Those whom I love, I chasten".

mugwump said...

Ist thy incohereant rambling chastisment?

onthestreet said...

Yes, first the voice as one in the wilderness. Then the greater testimony.

mugwump said...

You are neither Elijah nor John the Baptist. The wilderness you dwell in is sin.

onthestreet said...

Correct.

mugwump said...

And you rejoice in your accomodation? Do you not fear God?

onthestreet said...

"All men have sinned". DO YOU NOT BELIEVE GOD???????????????? In his service there is no fear, but love.

mugwump said...

Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.

onthestreet said...

Yes, and like a toddler, you are just beginning.

mugwump said...

I may toddle, but at least I stand upright. Grow up and get off your belly street!

onthestreet said...

What's a "belly street"? Oh, I get it. A belly reals too and fro like your streets will do when the earth quakes. Toddlers fall.

mugwump said...

the one you grovel upon.

Anonymous said...

jeffs a victim??? what a joke. the women and children that are raped and molested by him and others like him are the victims. dont forget about the teen age boys that are driven out of the community when they begin to come of age and start desiring women. they get thrown out like garbage because the old rich or favored polygamists dont want the competition.