Wednesday, July 26, 2006

FLDS and Fundamentalists and Polygamy

Mormon Fundamentalists believe in the original doctrine. This question seems to come up all the time. They believe in the original doctrine as set fourth by Joseph Smith including polygamy. Since then, about 200 years have past and the LDS have tried their best to change the original doctrine. They have had many Prophets over this period of years. Some where the real thing and others like today were charlatans. The FLDS and other fundamental Mormon sects and denominations find the changes made to the original doctrine to be an abomination and a covenant with death itself.
that's why there are so many sects and denominations to the Mormon Church. And the list is growing and growing all the time.

8 comments:

Anonymous said...

Why are you flooding the blog with topics?

Is someone trying to destroy this blog?

I am about ready to give up.

How about just starting a new topic for each day's posts? Nobody follows the topic anyhow.

Please note that I, for example, feel absolutely no compulsion to follow the topic.

Alma said...

Fundy claimed, "Mormon Fundamentalists believe in the original doctrine. This question seems to come up all the time. They believe in the original doctrine as set fourth by Joseph Smith including polygamy."

I say hogwash to that. There are a couple of very important elements missed by fundamentalists in their illicit relations under the guise of polygamy. They are:

1) Authority. Section 132 points out that only one man at a time on the earth ever holds the keys of the sealing power, and that unless performed by proper authority, plural marriage is invalid. Brigham Young wrote to William Smith with regard to who could perform sealings and Pres. Young's quote of Joseph Smith is univerally disregarded by fundamentalists. He wrote, "Joseph said that the sealing power is always vested in one man, and that there never was and never would be but one man on the earth at a time to hold the keys of the sealing power in the church that all sealings must be performed by the man holding the keys or by his dictation, and that man is the president of the church.” Parley P. Pratt also quoted Joseph as saying, “This last key of the priesthood is the most sacred of all, and pertains exclusively the first presidency of the church, without whose sanction and approval or authority, no sealing blessing shall be administered pertaining to things of the resurrection and the life to come.”
Since this authority rests with the First Presidency of the Church, you guys who have followed those who have been excommunicated from the Church can have no authority. It’s really simple. Notice the role the "Church" plays in this authority?

2) Authority: “And this shall be a law unto you, that ye receive not the teachings of any that shall come before you as revelations or commandments; And this I give unto you that you may not be deceived, that you may know they are not of me. For verily I say unto you, that he that is ordained of me shall come in at the gate and be ordained as I have told you before,” How many fundamentalists have "come in at the gate" and been voted on by the saints? (hint: it's less than "1")

3) Authority: “We believe that a man must be called of God by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.” There isn’t one member of fundamentalism who was ever legally ordained or called or sustained to lead the people. That means they have the authority of a peeled zero. You have the audacity to claim that you follow the original teachings of Joseph Smith when you disregard the most important ones regarding the need for proper authority.

ATAR_i said...

Interesting alma, so are you saying that the power resides only with LDS leadership should they decide to use it? I think that's what your saying, but I'm not certain.

onthestreet said...

ALMA Said (7/26/2006 8:20 PM): Since this authority rests with the First Presidency of the Church, you guys who have followed those who have been excommunicated from the Church can have no authority. It’s really simple. Notice the role the "Church" plays in this authority?

STREET’s Reply: And you guys have followed those who are truly the ones excommunicated from the Church, since God Himself decides who His church is, and He decided by visiting its President in 1886, revealing to him that He would continue His church through a special dispensation, and ordained, called, and sustained others to do so. “Where two or more are met in my name, there will I be also”. So are masses important to the Lord, if they reject parts of His Gospel? Indeed, throughout the ages, all of Israel has been rejected. We all know this, and it is God’s word: “Few there be that find it”, not many but FEW. Of course, you not believing this is irrelevant, except to only prove you to be an unbeliever.

Now, what is the sign of the true church? “Ye shall know them by their fruits” (Jesus Christ). And what are the fruits? Many children are the fruits of the loin, obviously, and “Let the little children come”, saith the Lord. Creation is what God does, and to try to stifle that is to be an enemy of God, NOT His true church. You have the audacity to claim that you follow the original teachings of Joseph Smith when you disregard the most important ones regarding the need for proper authority. Is God not proper, in coming to the Church President John Taylor, to properly authorize? Your President had to hide up because there weren’t enough in the church membership to support him or defend him. This is a matter of public record.

Anonymous said...

BULL, That's right Fundy,OTS, & Barlow have flooded this blog with lot's of BULL, it's getting so deep one need's hip waders!

Speaking of Bull there's just the festival for you all in Eldorado, Texas Running of the Bull

With the BULL that has been posted on this blog, OTS, Barlow, & Fundy are sure the win the prize for BULL! :)

Alma said...

That's exactly what I'm saying.

god wannabe said...

Very interesting. It looks like the FLDS are the true followers of Joseph Smith.

The FLDS believe in one leader, one Prophet, just as most LDS do; but that the President of the Church does not have to be that one man.

"Perhaps it may make some of you stumble, were I to ask you a question-- Does a man's being the a Prophet in this church prove that he shall be the President of it? I answer, NO! A man may be a Prophet, Seer, and Revelator, and it may have nothing to do with his being the President of the Church. ...when he (Joseph) was called to preside over the Church it was by the voice of the people; though he held the keys of the Priesthood INDEPENDANT of their voice." (Brighm Young, JD 1:133)

"If men hold the keys of the Kingdom of God, they are not dependant upon men to support their claims; but the Church and all the world is dependant on them and on the keys committed to them for the ministration of salvation." (Parley P. Pratt Mill Star 6:93)

You will find that most all the Polygnist groups except the FLDS church deny the "one man" rule. Wilford Woodruff changed the one man rule. He was never the Prophet, but he did become the third President of the Church. Wilford Woodruff supposedly received a revelation from God for John Taylor, his senior in Priesthood, but his junior in age, in the year of 1880. In that revelation he states that all the Apostles hold all the leadership keys in common. Which is confusion any way you look at it.

While John Taylor was in hiding he ordained five men.
"He called five of us together: Samuel Bateman, Charles H Wilkins, George Q Cannon, John W. Woolley, and myself. He then set us apart and placed us under covenant that while we lived we would see to it that no year passed by without children being born in the principle of plural marriage. We were given authority to ordain others if necessary, to carry this work on, they in turn to be given authority to ordain others when necessary, under the direction of the worthy senior (by ordination), so that there should be no cessation in the work"
(Statement of Lorin C Woolley 9/22/1929)

Then in 1890 Wilford Woodruff signs a manifesto. One that John Taylor said he would rather have is arm torn from its socket than to sign such a document.

All Polygnist groups have a connection to John Whooley and Lorin Whooley except the Labaron group. But most of them hold on to the notion that Wilford Woodruff was the Prophet, and that the one mighty and strong will come and make the church start believing in Polygamy again. Even up to 1979 when Marion Hammon, Alma Timpson, and Guy Musser were excommunicated by Leroy S Johnson, the FLDS people were taught these things. But they were not taught by any who stood by Leroy S. Johnson.

The other doctrine that no other people besides the FLDS live, is the doctrine of the United Order, which is to men what plural marriage is to women.

Very simple isnt it?

By the way, Esther E. E. Morrison is MY great grandmother, I have her recorded voice saying that quote, and she is NOT being prodded by her son Fred. He was just helping his 81 year old mother to record her voice on the tape. She was reading her own writing. Let me give you her words just before the mentioned quote:
“At the time the manifesto was signed, I was staying with Mary.(Her older sister) I remember so vividly when the word came about this, as father, mother, Charlie’s father Carl Runchrist[sp?], and mother were in Mary’s home. Everything was so quiet, and it seemed as though there was a feeling of some terrible happening taking place. It was felt in the home and outside even in my young years, about 8 or 9 years old, and not understanding the great significance of what happened, I felt the dreadful impact of it.
Years later, about 1925, I attended…”

TBM said...

Whether it's her words or not, god wannabe, makes not the slightest diference to the fact that she's quoting an ancient hearsay, which is flatly contradicted by Wilford Woodruff's journal.