Saturday, May 13, 2006

Blind Eye to Culture of Abuse

Winston looking a little concerned! Posible criminal charges?

If my name was Rodney Parker, Ron Thompson, David Nuffer or Steven Snow, as an attorney I might be wondering if the new claims of Organized Crime under the RICO Act apply to greedy lawyers? It seems Rod Parkers name still appears as the registered agent for several FLDS firms. Rulon & Warren were not "rocket scientist" but they did hire influential attorneys.

Where would a congressional probe end? I bet there are few politicians wondering the same question tonight! The Los Angeles Times noted the 87 witnesses for Sam Barlow in the 1987 Arizona DPS investigation. A who is who from local government. There are a few more that contributed to the Enterprise since and if it is Organized Crime as General Shurtleff suggests, then I might just enjoy watching this show. Can't call it BIG LOVE! I'll let you suggest some titles...

I suggest the following reading;,0,3267921.story?coll=la-home-headlines


Men In Black said...

No room for debate, the Los Angeles Times has the book and can do exact quotes;

The practice is sanctioned in the FLDS text "In Light and Truth: Raising Children in the Family Order of Heaven." The book, which includes such chapters as "Your Husband Is Your Lord and Master," says any man dishonoring his priesthood or marriage covenant "forfeits his wives and children.",1,3435771.story?coll=la-news-a_section

This one is Richard Holms story. Family values? Where a wives and children are reassigned at the drop of a hat.

Anonymous said...

In a nut shell; the investigators are singing a new tune. Kirk Smith as Washington County Sheriff is quoted below, followed by someone from the mainstream church. We see this issue seperatley than those from the mainstream church!

April 2001
"Someone on the outside can worry that children are being groomed to be polygamists, but I can't charge into someone's home on that worry any more than I could if someone told me that Mormon parents are grooming their children to someday be LDS missionaries."
May 2003
"They are all over the place," Washington County Sheriff Kirk Smith said. "We have them literally in every county in the state of Utah. It's not uncommon in the Western United States."
May 12th 2006 SLC Tribune
Polygamy never renounced
With Warren Jeffs on the lam, and HBO's "Big Love" giving the world a look at polygamy in a modern context, there has been much discussion and controversy surrounding polygamy and the LDS Church doctrine regarding plural wives.
As a lifelong church member and student of LDS scripture and prophetic teachings, my understanding of the subject is that the principle of plural marriage is a fundamental doctrine of the LDS Church. It is taught in the Doctrine and Covenants (section 132) and in numerous talks and writings from LDS prophets and apostles.
LDS doctrine clearly teaches that gods and goddesses in celestial realms practice the principle of plural marriage. The doctrine is held in abeyance at the moment because of inhospitable social and legal circumstances in the United States, but it will be practiced during the millenial reign of Jesus Christ on Earth by all who are faithful to him and his true prophets. I have yet to hear or read an official statement from the LDS Church, its prophets or apostles, that contradicts this belief.

Keith Klundt

CHRH said...

In an interview with Larry King, Gordon Hinckley said that plural marriage was "not doctrinal" in the church. Oops.

Anonymous said...

CHRH said...

In an interview with Larry King, Gordon Hinckley said that plural marriage was "not doctrinal" in the church. Oops.


If it is "not doctrinal" then why is it today in the LDS MORMON's book of DOCTRINE and COVENANTS?

Sounds like current DOCTRINE to me!

Anonymous said...

I have some name suggestions:


"Up the Short Creek without a paddle"

"We need a new Prophet"

"See ya in the BIG House"

"RICO Warren and his mighty band of fools"

"Warren does RICO"

CHRH said...

Thats my point anon. Good ole Gordy slipped. He's such a tool.

Anonymous said...

So what tune do you suppose that Orrin was playing on that old organ?

keep sweet eldorado

Anonymous said...

Why dont someone check out the revised additon of The
Doctrine and Covenants by James E. Talmage. Revelations of More enduring Value? Quite a name for a book. The Section 132 was taking out, very interesting. Lets see what happens to the church when they try too quit printing that section. By the way, If we are't supposed to live plural marriage because its against the law. What happens if they make a law to quit paying tithing. Are they then going to say its not doctrinal.We not have to do it in this life,just the next. It sounds like the only religion people adhere to is called THE CHURCH OF POPULAR VOTE. What ever they decide becomes the true church doctrine.Please will someone give me a church that does't change because of popular vote. I'm amazed.

mugwump said...

In all probability you who profess LDS or FLDS doctrine are not going to like this statement. Nevertheless it is one you need to consider.

I believe the Bible Genesis through Revelation. It is the COMPLETE Word of God and provides followers of Christ with everything, every truth, every blessing, every promise that man needs to live a full life. I believe that this is the complete inerrant work of God. There is nothing else that man can do to gain greater understanding and fellowship with THE LIVING GOD than through repentance of sin and acceptance of the life, death and resurection of JESUS CHRIST, GOD'S ONLY SON as his Redeemer and Lord.
At that point my soul, which has been governed by the free will God provided to Adam in Eden, has passed from my control into God's. I am no longer my own person, but am now God's child.

Imaginations of step by step improvement of an individual toward a celestial relationship with a worshiping underling world is at very best the ultimate form of idoltry. to believe that you are becoming God is the equivilent of man worshiping man. Man thus is creating himself as god.

Why would I believe this? Translations of the Bible have remained essentially the same from the earliest manusctipts through the most recent translations. Greek, Hebrew and Aramic scholars have reviewed the translations in current use, have compared those translations to the most ancient manuscripts and earliest translations and have determined that the message has remained the same. More modern language has been used in the later translations, but the truth found within the text remains unchanging.

This in no way discounts the apocalyptic works as false, it simply does not recognize them as divinely inspired. The are historical, nothing else.

The Bible, being the complete message from God to Man has been proven again and again to redeem, restore, and revitalize the human existance and lead him (it) into a restored, revitalized and a redeemed state of existance.

Isaiah 55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

This scripture, revered by Christians and Jews alike worldwide as a vital truth underwrites that man may attempt to equal God in His thoughts, and guess the direction God would lead outside of living in faith. But when man attempts to speak for God he must ensure that the spirit which directs his thought is the Spirit of God. Test the Spirits, to gain the truth.

Study, to show thyself approved, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of truth.

onthestreet said...

So do.

mugwump said...

Considering I am not my own person but God's child, I am doing so.

onthestreet said...

If you have not your true self, then you are NOT God's child, for God is true.

mugwump said...


I know God. Yes HE IS truth. He is my friend. Can you say the same?

onthestreet said...

Ahh, the infantile jibe: "Can you say the same". Throughout the ages, men have claimed to know God, and have gone down with the wicked. Satan also knows, and trembles.

To know God, you must be perfect, for God is perfect. If you do not know perfection, then you do not know God, see? It is mere fantasy, to be seen and to obtain praise.

mugwump said...

What's your excuse. Madness I suspect.

No matter what you say, I KNOW GOD, Yes he is TRUTH, He is MY FRIEND and CONSTANT Companion. My question to you is, can you say the same?

I know HIM, HE knows me. He is perfect, I am a sinner, He knew my imperfection before my creation and provided reconciliation between HIMSELF and me. Knowing that the blood of rams and bullocks would not wash away the sin of humanity HE, HIMSELF provided the sin price in the PERSON of Jesus Christ. Who came to earth, all man, all GOD to give His own blood in redemption of the sins of all mankind forever. I trust HIS WORD and PROMISE. Can you make the same claim?

onthestreet said...

I knew a man named Les. Are you more, or less?

mugwump said...

soddy bottom

you will never catch on. The whole point is not about me, it's about the Lord.

you still didn't answer the question.

Anonymous said...

Mr. Mugwump:

Didn't your mother teach you not to argue with fools? You will never get them to admit defeat and there is always the possibility that a stranger watching from the outside might not be able to tell you apart.

mugwump said...

Well, is this a presumption that you are finally identifying yourself? I will not call you nor anyone else a fool. If you do so it is of your own calling, not mine.

mugwump said...

Regarding "Fool" See Matt. Chapt. 5:22 following colon: at end of verse.