Friday, July 08, 2005

G-men want Warren

FBI Seeking Polygamous Community Prophet

Special Agent in Charge Jana D. Monroe of the Federal Bureau of Investigation announced today Friday that the FBI and the Mojave County Attorney's Office are requesting the public's assistance with information concerning the whereabouts of Warren Steed Jeffs. Jeffs, prophet of the polygamous community known as the Fundamentalist Latter Day Saints, is being sought in a joint effort by the FBI and the Mojave County Attorney’s Office. An arrest warrant was issued by the Mojave County Attorney on June 9, 2005 charging Jeffs with sexual conduct with a minor and conspiracy to commit sexual conduct with a minor. Jeffs was subsequently charged with unlawful flight to avoid prosecution, in a federal arrest warrant, issued by the United States Magistrate Court, District of Arizona, Flagstaff, Arizona, on June 27, 2005. Jeffs is described as being 6’4" in height, weighing 150 lbs, and having brown colored eyes and hair. Investigation indicates Jeffs has previously been in Texas, Colorado and British Columbia. The FBI requests anyone with information concerning Jeffs’ whereabouts to contact the FBI, Flagstaff Office, 928-774-0631, or the Mojave County Sheriff’s Office 1-800-526-1911.

KPHO News 5 - Phoenix
KPHO.com
Originally broadcast July 8, 2005

140 comments:

Anonymous said...

About time,Way past time,I question the sincerity of any law enforcements efforts to apprehend Warren Jeffs.Lets face facts.Warren could have been caught
dozens of times over already.But Justice appears blind.IF the feds dont want to catch AL-Qaida, What makes you think they will go after Warren?I'll bet Warren is setting up some where ,eating pork chops,Laughing at us all.

outsider said...

you should have seen all the mohave sheriffs that where patroling the streets today!!!! it was a mad house, they attempted to serve a warrant to Kelly Ficsher. I don't know if they got him but there were ALOT of cops in and around his house looking for him.
The poor colorado city police looked as lost as could be, they had no idea this was going to happen. Pretty funny if you ask me

GBNF said...

Somebody call America's Most Wanted!

outsider said...

I'm not kidding it was amazing!!!

GBNF said...

I think justice is awesome!

Anonymous said...

And did they find him. You glory in your failure. He is not known in his where-abouts. God will not suffer that he be subjected to your filth. You seek an inacent man. Like Jesus's own people sought his life. It is written to prepare for the second coming of Christ and the millianial rein. The thousand years of peace. What do you think will bring peace? A governments gun's? accusations? Robbery of land? What do you supose will bring a change upon people to lay down their warefare? I think that war in itself will make men anxiouse for peace. A country was bombed. They said on the news, not such a thing was seen since warld war two. Yet, other countrys have suffered greater calamitys daily. To some it is a paper story. To others it is a brother dead. A freind buried. A loss. fire has come. Fire has gone. Trouble besets us all. Who then has excaped unscathed. You pay every day for the death of another mans country man. Our oil is fought over. Greed is a terrible thing. Peace will be in the rockie mountians. It is written, no man can undo it. God has decreed it. And you woud try to undo it. you would stop the filling of the grainry's. One cheats his neighbor and charges another man for the deed. And what would our prophet have given you? every thing, but you would fight him for what he gave. You call him cruel and hold to your imorality and theifery. What would he give this nation. Peace, but you seek war. And will God change his course? I say you fulfill prophacy with every word. it is written what the wicked will do. What the rightouse will do. And we fullfil it. Good or evil. Joeseph said, I teach the people correct principles and they govern themselfs. You have all been tought. All are left with out excuse. Even Don Timpson was tought. HIs father may have been what he was, but he was tought. In his hands he has access to the book of mormon, Yet he would have his name on a paper to take another mans land. He does not want in our church, yet he suposes he can fill. I say that any soul that puts their name upon the documents to take or break up the trust is a dishonorable man. And the Pipkin man, You already spent enough money on trying to break it up, that would build a city. You are getting old. ARe you not interested in doing any thing besides fighting before you go to meet your maker. Who will suport you. Fighters only do one thing. They fight. The peace makers will go about staying out of your way, like they always have. All of you, that love and make a lie, You have entangled your self in lies. That is the nature of lies. Will it then bring you eternal joy. The U.E.P means the united effort plan. Are you united in effort. can you break up a trust. Trust is in "we the people" united effort is in supporting all. Do you love your neighbor as yourself? I say would you put your neighbor out, then god will put you out. And what is our glory? What we came by honestly. NO man can take it. In death and in life. Good does go up to the heavens to be multiplied. Truth is always forever before Gods face. ARE YOU A PEACE MAKER. I WILL NOT SUPORT ANY ONE WHO PUTS THERE NAME TO THE LAND SCAM. WE HAVE A PROPHET IN ZION;

Anonymous said...

Yada Yada Yada

Anonymous said...

Has anyone read the Eldorado Success story. Kelly Fischer is not the only one on the lamb.

lusitania dupree said...

keep up the good work!@!

Anonymous said...

well well i have to wonder what god he is with becouse so many of that people are thieves they still from each others kelly fisher is one tom holm another dan holm fred jessop willie jessop these are just some of gods people willie jessop destroyed steeds inc. and yet he is one of warren good fallowers and allen steed is out tom holm just before he went bankrupt at telacor he had all his employs go and take lones out to help his company and then told them he was not going to pay the lones i know one man that is still paying that lone back to keep his good name oh and by the way he is not with warren any more fred jessop dont pay his subs when they do work for him you people think you are the people of god think again you are so far from god that god is not even fighting your battles any more here is another dan holm owes a man 200.00 dallors and well not pay the man wally jessop owes the same man a lot of money but wont pay him and i could keep going on and yet you people are so far from the god that he wont fight your battles oh and by the way warron and sam already broke the uep a long time ago all the states are trying to do is put it back were uncle roy had it so no man can be kick out

Anonymous said...

"Peace will be in the rockie mountians. It is written, no man can undo it. God has decreed it."

Ruth, If what you say is truth then why are Warren and his minions scurrying away to Texas? Texas is far from the Rockies.

Anonymous said...

hey 10:44

You make some good points and you have a valid beef. However, if you would use some punctuation to seperate your one big run-on sentence, we would be able to glean what you mean. Some of your names are inseperable so we don't know who you are talking about. And I've never heard of Dan Holm.

Heck, we will even overlook your spelling if you will seperate your thoughts for us!

ATAR_i said...

Ruth, one thing that I have learned is that people cannot always understand the circumstances of another.

Someone might have been treated poorly by warren - how would you know? (If it didn't happen to you). You feel you were treated appropriately and kindly, and dealt with in a loving manner - that's great.

But you can't tell someone else that their experience is exactly as yours - that warren acted the exact same way. If you weren't there - it's something you can't know.

So, you can proclaim your own life experiences, and do so with pride, but you can't tell everyones how they felt and how they were treated.

I understand your heart is yearning for the thing that you want, the peace that was promised, the community that could be. But you cannot, and warren cannot bang, clatter, stomp, storm and rage and expect in return utopia and perfect peace.

Anonymous said...

Atar
I was just curious do you have any polygamy in your background? If so what group did you come from?

Anonymous said...

Help! Im lost, if my fam doesn't follow WJ, then who is our prophet? What rules (outside those in BOM) do we follow? If he's caught, who is the new Prophet??? It's gonna happen and what do we do when he's in jail, who will be annointed?

Anonymous said...

Ruth wasn't treated kindly by
Warren; she imagines what she wishes were true and soon she starts to believe herself.

Anonymous said...

sorry about the punctuations. i just get typing and dont pay attention. and sorry about my spelling but at lease i am trying to get the point across ti all the warren people. that they are far from the people that they think they are. you dont treat people bad and think that god well proect them.

Anonymous said...

I am sure if you study the scriptures you will see, that God does not treat a lier the same as he does a faithful, honest member. And It is written, "You shall be your own judge. As your faith is so shall it be." You obviously have your desires. You have set the law against an inacent man. You have in your own minds succeded in getting the government to intervene in the illegal theifery of land. You have put claim to what you already had, and would have kept if you had loved each other. Did it bring you joy. I will not name names, but I will ask: To one; did you see your childrens children today. Remeber the prayer that opened the door that day. To the two that ran away and got on the glory show: did you find joy? Is your mother loving you today? To the one who took another in: Do your children love you. They looked pained on the Dr. Phil show. What was your message that day. I weep and I am not your mother. The one who help a girl go, and lost his family, too: Did God send peace to your soul? And the one who brought the show to the lawn: Did you keep the girl? Did your joy increase? You had your desire. Did it bring joy? WAr is Ugly. Lies never end. They hang on to a lier, and smite him. I would ask The ones who sit it there houses, Was that enough to bring you joy? A house does not bring peace. How many of you loved God more than the gift he gave? He doeth give all. Peace was not prophicied for all men: Only those who will not take up arms against his brother. Who have you told you loved today? What good did you seek out. OUr Prophet has not been available for two years, Yet in that time, you saction the dividing of our land. CAN YOU THEN KEEP IT TOGETHER? Is there any here that can even say any good about your neighbor. A three dimensional divideing line has been drawn. Two sides drawn up on each side of the fence. EAch side throwing stones at each other. each claiming they are right, and every one else is wrong. And the third line: those that do it and suffer your persicution. There are some screaming to give the land back to the original owners, and some screaming to give it to the desenters. Those that have no desire to keep our church in operation, but to bring all worldly things into our mitze: Yet if that were the condition we were in: Where would be the prophacy be fullfiled that says, I will set up an ensign unto the world, and they shall be hated of all people. We are a percular people. If we were of the world we would only be worldly people. They have expulged God from them, and only mock the ones who live the law. There lies and rumors are spread across the nation to fulfill the words of the prophets. From Adam to Now. You look for another prophet in Zion. The books are full of testiomnie of the prophets. There are tales of women excapeing and stories of our tyrany. Yet you are the people. You are the ones who have turned from the Gospel. Our prophet compelled you to repent, before He went. The charges came after. I remember when you sat in church and confessed your love to some degree. WE were tought. You have no excuse. Blaming someone else for your problem is just what fighters do. Yet, you can not find him. Nor, will you. You have chosen. WE were tought unconditional love. Who have you loved unconditionaly? Look around you, why you scream about your injustaces: Who do you know in our commiunity you would like to see fail. Who would you put out of there home, because of your inability to see good in life. A house too big. A house too small. A dollar here, a dollar there, why your stuff piles high. Uncle Rulon said he would carry you into heaven on his back if he could, and you try to divide his blessings. He is one of the original trust members. Uncle Roy also. Fred Jessop. And you would try to divide. Greed. How many of you want your home. How many of you want your church. HOw many of you want your world. Your movies, your split skirts, your books. How many of you want what the world has to offer. The Lord delivered it up. How many of you want war. That also will be delivered up to you. How many of you wanted a girl with no commitments. How many of you wanted a boy with no commitments. The ones who ran away are still there, were they went. OUr children are scattered. Uncle Roy said, Two will be in the feild one will be taken the other left. What did he mean exactly? One does go with the prophet. One is left. Why? Because they chose it. Who will go with Zion? Zion is the pure in heart. A t.v. show will not bring it. Your critazism will not bring it. What then will bring about peace? This is a choice you alone will make. Forgiveness brings peace. Loving unconditional brings peace. Sacrificing brings peace. We are at war. How many of you are prepared to pay the consiquences of war. If the mob was upon us, because of the lies that: we are a violent people, who would you want to see martered. You people mock my words of peace. Do you then enjoy war? I challange you. Go out on the street. Look around. Go as the apostles of old, with out purse or script. Go as the saints before, with your houses burning, and your loved ones buried in the snow. Try the handcart company treck. Walk with out tar. Pull a buggy with a horse. Load your family up. Leave all your belongings. Go to a place where children are not fed. Go to Florida, after the storm. Try a mexicans treck to a land portrayed as the Land of the Free, and meet a border patrole. Go to New york. Watch the homeless. Go to pheonix. Watch the homeless. Go into the hospitals. SEe the ones that die, from desiese that Doctors say there is no cure for, and they are charged a mint. Money that would have built dozens of houses. But what was the desire of your hearts? Read Corahore, and when your day is over, what have you to account for.

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous 7/09/2005 1:21 PM :
Why do we need a prophet to tell us what to do? Nothing bad will happen unless we do it to ourselves.

What we are required to do now is stand on our own two feet, and do what is right and let the consequences follow; God will protect us in doing what's right.

We now have to cultivate our own personal relationship with God. That truly does not require a prophet. It just requires each individual to do the work and stop depending on someone else to keep you on their idea of the straight and narrow. The more you practice, the easier it gets.

And in that process we also cultivate wonderful relationships with our families and friends. Does that seem too hard?

Personally, I look upon the turn of events as a heaven-sent opportunity - an opportunity to be my own leader. I believe that's absolutely true for both men and women and teaching our children the same. No prophet is responsible for my salvation; it's my job and mine alone. I cannot save anyone else; I can only set a good example.

Only God knows what's in your heart. No other mortal does - and that's all that ANY of the prophets have ever been - mortals who have mortal weaknesses and their own trials of life. We all make mistakes and we can all learn from them. That is the key... learning by doing and being like our brother, Jesus Christ. He set the example for the rest of us.

ATAR_i said...

Ruth, I can't follow all your thoughts, they flow one into the other. If it were shorter and had paragraphs I would read it.

I have no polygamy in my background.

I don't mock you, but I ask that you try and look at some things from another angle. And, if you cannot do that, at least admit, there are more viewpoints than just yours.

I would think a lady of your life experience would not be one to put her own thoughts and ideas out as the ONLY ones that have any validity or moral voracity.

I once believed like you, in a leader (like you call prophet). I would not have listened to anyone who dared speak against him. I wasted too much time feeling superior and right. I wish I had listened more. I wish for you that chance as well.

Anonymous said...

And you say you have no need of a Prophet, yet you confess you need what he advised you to have. A prophet is one who can speak to you, as God reveals it to him. A prophet is a person who can get on their knee's and ask god, and get an answer. To say you have no need of a prophet, is to say you have no need of God. I say we have had the prophets. Lets do the work. A prophet speaks and the Angels carry it out. You alone can do your work. A prophet can teach. He can compell. You have to do your work. Ask and it shall be given. I think you shall see your loved ones again. A little faith can grow into a lot of faith. But lets all turn from unbeleif unless it consumes us, and our day of propbation is over. Jesus is the greatest prophet that has been upon the earth, yet all prophets wished they could live in our day. WE are Ephrimite. Put on your beautiful garments.

Anonymous said...

Journal of discourse 5
As Joeseph Smith has sealed his testimony with his blood, his testament is now of force: and I will quote again from a revelation given through him, on Fishing river, Missouri, June 22, 1834: "Therefore it is expedient in me that mine Elders should wait for a little season for the redemption of Zion; for I do not require at their hands to fight the battles of Zion: for, as I said in a former commandment, even so will I fulfil-I will fight your battles."
Again, the presence of an armed force will prove to ourselves, to God and angels, which we possess the most of-the fear of God or the fear of man. We are commanded to fear not them that can kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do; but we are required to fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. But there is one scripture which says--"When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the Lord shall lift up a standard against him." He will make the wrath of man to praise him, and the remainder of wrath he will restrain. We have all got to die at some time, and why should we object to the time or the manner? If we are right before the Lord, and in the discharge of our duty, it matters not when or how we go hence.

Anonymous said...

ISAIAH CHAPTER 59

http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/59/19

Read the WHOLE chapter.

Anonymous said...

http://scriptures.lds.org/isa/60
THE BOOK OF THE PROPHET
ISAIAH

CHAPTER 60
In the last days, Israel shall rise again as a mighty nation—Gentile peoples shall join with and serve her—Zion shall be established—Finally, they shall dwell in celestial splendor.

ATAR_i said...

Israel - I've always wanted to go there. I think I will someday. Already sprucing up on my yiddish.

Anonymous said...

et mon droit

fttc said...

Sorry for such an abrupt change in topic but I have some questions.

I was told by someone still on the inside that several men have been arrested and will go to jail without a trial for underage marriages. Also that the underage law passed by Utah was made 10 years retroactive. This sounds like the info that Warren would pass onto his believers to get them to fear the law. Can anyone shed some light on this for me that has some legal experience?

Anonymous said...

If we dn' have a Prophet who will speak for us? The gentiles will be able to stop our familes. Who will tell us what the rules are?

Do I even need my garments? What if I desire another wife? Who do I pay my tithin' to? Does my wives need to continue braided their hair...why? because all of this isn't in the BOM, it was set by prophet who are no longer there!!!!
This is our chance to live our religion and be free from thair rules and spyin on our neighbors to see that their follown them. Who's with me?

HardHeaded said...

Ruth,
If you want to please your' prophet, the first thing you should do is quit participating in this blog. He has made it clear that the Lord is not pleased with they that do so.

Food for thought.

HardHeaded said...

Not that I don't like hearing what you have to say.......

Anonymous said...

to 8:17 it sounds to me like you have never read any scriptures.

And to 8:14 Wake up and smell the roses. They have been having sentancing with out trials for awhile now.
What do you think ruby ridge and Waco was all about.
Do you hnestly believe that the Twin Towers were crashed into and our government with all there suposed great knowedge to EVEN PUT A MAN ON THE MOON, that planes could fly in our air space and they would not know it.
Why do you supose that some-one burned the flag in hurricane? Cause they liked the candy?
All you have to do to be a crimnal today is worship Christ, Home school and suport the belief "in God with liberty to all."

ATAR_i said...

What does reading scripture have to do with those far out ideas - and they are pretty odd.

All you have to do to be a criminal is break the law.

Guess what - taking taxpayer money to buy yourself a plane is against the law.

Using school vehichles for non-school activities is against school policies.

Polygamy is illegal

Marriage to a child is illegal

So, it's not the homeschooling (or lack of schooling at all - which is actually against the law too) or your belief in Christ (because I believe and no one is beating at my door).

You break the law, you get a knock at the door. So stop whining, you knew it was against the law. I can't feel sorry for you - be accountable.

Anonymous said...

They speak of me with there lips, but there hearts are far from me.

fttc said...

to 8:48

Can you document where any FLDS have been jailed without a trial? Focus on that for a moment and don't confuse yourself with things you are ignorant of.

fttc said...

Atar

Point well made! There are those who cannot get into thier understanding that laws should be respected. Lawbreakers should be punished.

I beleive in plural marriage as Joseph Smith revealed it. I know my country has made laws against its practice. If the day should come that I live that law and am called to account for it I will be punished for its practice. I know this going into it. If I did not have faith that it comes from God I would not be willing to make this sacrifice. I know the laws against it were directed at a specific religion and as such are unconstitutional on grounds of the first amendment.
In today's world I do not think I would be bothered by the law. If plural marriage is lived according to the fundamental teachings of Joseph Smith there is no abuse. What warren's followers fail to recognize is that it is the abuse that is trying to be stopped. Aside from those who have screamed about polygamy for decades, and they aren't many, I have heard no one complaining about consenting adults involved in polygamy. The AGs have stated several times they are not interested in prosecuting such.

Now those warrenites who are being prosecuted for under age marriages knew when they entered them that they were against the law, unless the law was made retroactive, which I don't believe it was. As you said they knew what they were in for so they shouldn't be complaining.

The other broken laws you mentioned need no comment.

Anonymous said...

And will you then prosicute your men who have imprgnated underage girls?
Will you jail and convict them for this?
Will you give them the same curtosy you give the ones you accuse and charge faulsly?
Journal of Discourses 26 page 281
Referring for one moment to the question of Plural marriage, I will here say that it is my candid opinion, freely expressed, that if fifty million of the people of the United States believed in Patriarchal marriage and only twenty in monogamic marriage, that the judges placed in power by the majority would decide and in favor of the Plural form of marriage, being religion. That prejudice and political influence affect the judgment of men in deciding such questions, no person can deny.

quiet canadian said...

This is so interesting. I wonder how many of these people who are now turning their backs on Warren Jeffs, immediatly condemned Winston when Warren publicly proclaimed that Winston had been dismissed. Hopefully, now you can all see who was really out of order. Who really desired to take over the control of the church. How many of you people supported Warren still when he dismissed Uncle Fred and took him away from his home, his family, his city, and finally his life? How many still support Warren as he destroys Colorado City and the United Effort Plan? How many supported Sam Barlow and the pod squad when they tried to pressure Uncle Roy and Uncle Fred into evicting the unbelievers and sending them out of town? It is no wonder the Lord has allowed this tragedy to befall the United Effort Plan. The people who it was designed to protect have gone against the basic values of our religeon and our God, in hopes of recieving something new. Well you have it now, SOMETHING NEW

Anonymous said...

Journal of Discourses book 26 page 286
Others may trample upon the laws of the land; Others may seek to bring us into bondage; but we shall be free through the help of our God, and our country shall be a free country; for if others trample upon the Constitutuon, we will elevate it, we will bear it aloft, we will invite the men of all cities and all parts of our lands to come and dwell in peace and safety protected by that glorious instrument, and the principles it contains, that God helped the founders of this government to frame.

Anonymous said...

Your memory doth fail you quiet Canadian: I sat in church the Day Rulon T. Jeffs told Winston he was removed from his position. He also said that he loved him very much and to not persicute him. And like the ones who you say, turn their backs on Warren, Winston Turned his back on a man who loved him and said he would carry him into heaven on his back if he could. I liked Winston. I liked his songs. I do not know why he turned away from Uncle Rulon. I was very sad that he did.

Anonymous said...

You are right about one thing: We have a new and everlasting covnant. Joeseph Smith established it, in this last dispinsation. It came of God. He has put the law into effect. He did not retract it. Men did. The church collectivly turned from the principles, thinking a church building would save them. IT IS THE PRINCIPLES OF THE GOSPEL THAT SAVE A PERSON. Other-wise you would not have any charactaristics of God. A name does not make a person. They say, we know it is a law, but we can not live it. Who then does fit the description written in the book of morman. From the stem of Jesse and the percular people? You have a chioce like all people. Live it or deny it. God is your paymaster. What will you have him deliver to you? As your faith is so shall it be.

outsider said...

what I want to know is where are the guy who pinged after working 20-22 hour days in Texas....Where is Warren, we have to find this guy before he can inflict anymore damage on these poor people....Especially Ruth...Maybe when Warren is in Jail she can come to the realization that he wasn't the one, and set her delusional(sp) mind on someone else

Anonymous said...

I was looking at a piture. It is a comic piture of the president. He is sitting in a big hot tub. It says on the tub Election win 2004 Beside him is a man with a towel. on the towel is written Blair. The man says Mr. President..... Your other hot tub awaits you. Behind him is a volcano. Beside it is a little sign that says Middle East

This can be found in a magizine called upfront. The New York Times UPFRONT. It is dated January 10, 2005

The front page piture is Bush with all the American soldiers, in uniform. The words above him say, "The President has laid out an agenda for his second term that is ambitious, complicated, and risky. Sounds like some of your opinions, Maybe and when, dilusional. Yup' good ol' America. Lets prosicute people who are differet than us. Lets take our guns over and put in our free system. Free? Quilty until proven inacent? Constitutional rights? And did you notice on the news, when they first went over seas, to stop terrorists and stop there production of weapons of war, that it was a bunker with old men and women in it, that was blown up. Yup! convicted with out trial. Oh, that was just an accident.LIke the branch dividians. Yup, like the Ruby ridge. Yet, What would you do, if the United states inflicted its own rules upon you. Shoot the people in shelters, stop the production of weapons of war. Oh, Ye proud! What would you do with out your guns, to inflick your free. And who is it you bury? Are we winning. Lets say that this government was to come in and put every man in Jail, who lived the law of Abraham, Isacc and Jacob, in jail. Would you have gained anything. Prove how big and powerful you are. WE know that. When you only put out lies. When you make laws for others you will not inflict on yourself. What a big, big state we have. They have put in a Morman Districk Attorney, that carries out persicutions on the People who will not give up the Principles. A church that claims to follow the same books, yet, they teach the doctrine of unbelief. Do we know you have the power to cnvict us? Do we know your court papers are bogus? Do we know your lies? Certianly. And the public in general have hated us all our lifes. Do we know this? Certianly. Do appostates hate us? Course. Will it change our beliefs? Some may turn from what they claim to believe. Some may have never believed and was only here for the glory ride and a well paying do nothing job. Sueing us year after year. Do you think the District attorney likes his job? To be the one to Jail inacent men, because public people who hear a few lies, can stir up trouble. I say, I am glad I am not the district attorney. He feels the pressure. I am glad I am not the President. To fill a warring peoples desires. You voted for war. You had a great debate. Who will fight the war the best. That was the only option given the voters. You collectivly voted for this. You willingly send your men and boys, and women into the battle. Who, then will pay the price. I say if history repeats itself. Look close at the story's of war. Will you be Nathan Hale. Will you be Paul Revere. Will you be on the trail of tears. Who will hold the Alamo. Who will write the constitution. Who will keep the flag flying why your soldier's die? Who will write the songs of war. And who like the son's of Helaman, will not fight? As your faith is, so shall it be.

Anonymous said...

Ruth why is it that you are so quick to say how the rest of the world is so proud, wicked and you and yours are the only people on earth that God loves. Who are you to judge. God blesses all of us, saint or sinner. Does he not bless us all with air to breath. Beautiful sunshine and the opportunity to do better each and every day that we are alive? Why do you say we are all liars? You dont even know any of us. You are quick to judge. Why dont you set the example. If you dont want to be judged dont judge others.

Anonymous said...

Does anybody have any info on the property near Cody Wyoming? I heard Warren has a hideout there and the property is believed to be registered in Jerold Williams name.

ATAR_i said...

Ruth, there is a splinter in your eye - mine too - gotta go.

Married to Wink said...

I know Winston did not leave Uncle Rulon, but did it not seem weird to any one else when Uncle Rulon had to ask what to tell the peaple in church,any one who went too church saw it happen.
Warren said that he had to be his father memory. Did anyone wonder why Winston wasn't called down south to be dismissed, I don't think Uncle Rulon even knew who he was talking to.
Oh befor I forget, from what I have seen it is Warren who dosen't know how to give a fair trial. A man can loose everything and not even know it tell his wife is someone elses, the family is told that their fathers sin is so bad but we don't get to know what it was.
I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW ANYONE CAN THINK THAT IS RIGHT

ATAR_i said...

I heard the tape of Rulon being told what to say as well. As a stroke victim, he was probably trying to retain as much functioning as he could. And, if someone he trusted stated he needed to do this - he would have just done it.

Stroke victims come in all different flavors, depending on where the damage is. He might not have had any idea who Blackmore was, or what he had done. But he might have remembered he was the leader, and people expected leadership from him.

An Opportunist could have used this to his benefit - and I think Did

Anonymous said...

You do confess your own apostasy, speaking thus of Uncle Rulon. Some said it of Uncle Roy too. Faith in God is increased in a persons eye. Sin also is beheld in your own eye. Do you then see, as a faithful member? Do you look as someone to justify sin? Jesus is the Judge. Can you say you live the law in purity. Are you happy in the choices you make. If you are, why do you complain? Why is there nothing good that can be said? When you look in the mirror, are you satisfied? Will rejoicing over other's troubles make you happy? Is putting one above another Gods law. WE are on a path. Each of us. The path of eternity. Spirit does not die, when It is seperated from the body. YOu then are still upon a path. ARe you satisfied? Will raids and war satisfy you? Will Jailing our men satisfy you? In diversity there is joy. In peace there is joy. If you look. Look around you. What is it you are not blessed in? And there is no doubt the helicopters will come. There is no doubt the law will come. Uncle Roy said, " When the day comes that they shut down our church, know these things are at our door." You people were tought what would happen. I was too. That day is here. "They will come in. A police man will stand on every door step. They will burn our books." Read the prophacy's. How is it that we have time to assult our neighbor. You think I judge you. You are my people. I feel like Uncle Rulon, when he said, I would carry you into heaven on my back if I could. I am so much weaker than he. He carried you for years. I am not able to carry anyone. We are in a day, that you will have to carry yourself, for better or worse. For rich or poor. In sickness and in health. You have accused the prophets. You have accused your neighbors. You have accused your friends. You have accused your enamies. We are on a threashold, of STAND ON YOUR OWN TWO FEET. WHO WILL PAY YOUR TAX? YOU WILL PAY YOUR COURT FEE'S. WHO WILL GIVE YOU YOUR HOUSES? WHO WILL BLESS YOUR WIFES AND CHILDREN? WHO WILL GET YOU OUT OF JAIL? AND I MAEAN YOU, BY 'THE QUILTY' IF THE SHOE FITS WEAR IT. A gentile will fare better, than those who had the light and forsakes there birth right. God will deliver the rightouse. God will walk with the faithful. There are books and books written on peoples testominies of the great Goodness of God. There are personal accounts that have been expressed. And if you want to know a persons battle, walt a mile inthere shoes. Go with out purse and script. See what the pioneer's gave up, so you could be spoilt and pampered. See what price they put upon what you scorned because of your riches and your easyness.

HardHeaded said...

" When the day comes that they shut down our church, know these things are at our door."That day is here. "They will come in. A police man will stand on every door step.

This day came and went and Warrenites were so blind, they did not see it.

Was it not Warren that shut down our church?

Was it not Warrens' henchmen standing on every doorstep, turning people away? Most of the people involved could not even see it.

Wake up people. Please wake up.

Anonymous said...

Warren is getting so crazy and nothing like Uncle Roy. Warren is becoming all the evil that Uncle Roy warned us about. Soon Warren is going to have to undo Uncle Roy and teach that Uncle Rulon has held the keys ever since Brother Barlow died. This is Warren's only escape from being the evil one of Uncle Roy's prophecies, is to undo Uncle Roy.

Anonymous said...

I see, you Texan's are still Gentleman. I think god does smile on you. My Lord will be protected.

ATAR_i said...

It is not apostacy to talk about how a stroke affects brain functioning.

I am quite satisfied when I look in the mirror.

I don't rejoice over others misfortunes.

I do not put ANYTHING above God's law in the BIBLE.

Policemen will NOT enter your home and burn your books.

Hating ME, accusing ME, does not make you righteous or right.

Making fearful pronouncements and attaching evil to the most normal human sentiments and tasks does not make them evil - it's just a paranoid way of looking at life, God, and your fellow man.

Anonymous said...

And Atari, I got my far out Ideas of of a news show. When they were blasting the branch dividians. They let a child lay dead in the yard. They shot a man on the water tower. They shot into the house. They shot two of there own F.B.I. agent's. I seen the tankers shoot fire into the building. I seen the second tape they put out saying that it was sun reflecting on the machine. Yes, in the second tape it was. In the first tape it was not. I listened to accounts as the Ruby ridge people were killed. I know of others taken into jail and tormented, that has not been filmed and spread on media film. My far out Idea's come from the news and people I encounter. What about your far out Ideas? Where do you get them? I wonder if you too, suport war. Did you watch the new's the day that the Old men and women and children were bombed over sea?

Anonymous said...

Hi y-all,

I've enjoyed reading your posts! I'm not FLDS, but if I wanted to read somethin' that would best capture what it's like to live it, what would I read?

LIlly

Anonymous said...

Not Ruth. Unless you want the Alice in Wonderland version.

Anonymous said...

Read the book of morman. Read the bible. Read the Journal of Discourses. Read the books of Brigham Young. Read Hebar C. Kimbal. Read Jacob Hamblim. Read Charles L. Walker. Get the older books. The main stream Morman church has changed some of there books. They have taken the Journals off the shelfs. Read the truth magisines. Go as written in the bible, in James and ask of God.

Married to Wink said...

I still beleive what I beleived before. That is that God cares about all his children, so if people will kick their own children out and pretent they don't exist. Dosen't that sound weird? I don't care what you believe, but be careful how you judge, if you don't know the facts then maybe you should look at your own life and make sure you're doing the best you know.
Let's just try to raise our children and love them, so when it is their turn to take care of us they will want to.
Believe me teenagers need understanding. They don't need to be kicked out. We were all there once. Why can't we remember?
I am a Mormon I have done my homework. I'm not converted to the man. I do love my family. I can't see how broken families can look right to anyone.
I'm not an apostate.

Anonymous said...

And Atari The cops are at our doors. Did you forget? You have been rooting them on. They have been arresting men. Is that not your great glory. Are you emphatic? You mock with your words. OUr church is shut down. The police are at our doors. You and the media and the apostates and the people who are stirred up in hatred and lies suport this. You openly say that you rejoice that they persicute us for our religion. There are poeple who say we are crimnals because we believe like the people in the bible. Then you say you believe the bible. What Part of Abraham, Iasacc and Jacob, that you believe would you be justified in. Would you say, "Yes, I believe but it was for them in that day, just not me." When you read the bible and it reads, "I am an unchangable God" What part did you believe. If he spoke to men then, why not now? If he had the Law then, why not now? What part in the bible in the account of Jesus do you believe. Walk a mile in your brothers shoes. Where in the bible does it say, "rejoice in the destrution of another soul."? Where is it written make war and tell your neighbors problems. Then some say, we have no need of a prophet. Where in the bible did the prophets speak? From Adam to now, the message has been the same, to all people. Who then will fill the law?

fttc said...

Anon 5:27

Just a minute! Not that Atar needs me to defend her but she didn't shut down your meetings. and for that matter neither did the cops. I have not seen the hatred in her you see either. If anyone here has been open to understanding it is her.

As far as making war Warren has fired the first shots. His teachings, decisions and actions have flooded the surrounding country with dilinquents. Why won't he answer to the charges against him? If he has nothing to hide he will be vindicated! This will only be turned into a Waco by such as you.

As for me or any one else being an apostate I wish you would show me what I apostitized from. Your church left the foundation that Joseph Smith estabilished and I chose not to follow along. I believe in every truth I believed in before warren.

I do not rejoice in the sufferings of our people. I do know that what they are suffering is nothing compared to what they have yet to pass through. Such is the suffering of those who once have the truth and reject it.

ATAR_i said...

You keep saying I rejoice in the destruction of anothers soul - or at your persecution. I do not.

I am satisfied when people who rape children get a rap on their door.

I am satisfied when people who steal get a knock at the door.

I can't say what will happen to your group is going to be a thrilling experience - it really isn't. Your group has turned your head hard and looked away from the law.

You have not rendered unto Ceasar the things that are Caesar, and you have disobeyed the laws of the land. These laws are not in conflict with the written word of God. You have done this of your own accord.

Your girls have been given in marriage underage. Do not cry that they are at your door. With every ounce of your life you have begged them to come.

If I do not want to go to jail - I obey the laws. They will not come to your door if you do not invite them by your actions.

fttc said...

By the way, how old were Abraham and Sarah when they were married?

Anonymous said...

Ruth,
No true believer in Christ Jesus is rejoicing over your people situation.

If your people must have a prophet, let the members of your religion vote one in.

Prophecy is a gift from God, but not the most important one. It just a hand on the body of Christ.
The body of Christ on earth is a church of believers.

Not just one man.

Dear Ruth, Warren Jeffs has polluted Christ body his church. He has split up families, lied, misrepresented his message and broke the laws of God and man.

Ruth if you are a believer in Jesus and have the faith that he lived and died for your sins and you have asked for forgiveness you are as much a part of the body of Christ as Warren Jeffs and you are as important member of the body of Christ with a special gift given to you by the Holy Spirit.


RUTH READ VERSE 28

Corinthians Chapter 12

1 Corinthians 12
Spiritual Gifts

1 Now about spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be ignorant.

2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols.

3 Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord.

6 There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.

7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.

8 To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,

9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit,

10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[b]

11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.

12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ.

13 For we were all baptized by[c] one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.

14 Now the body is not made up of one part but of many.

15 If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body.

16 And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body.

17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be.

19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20As it is, there are many parts, but one body.

21 The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!"

22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable,

23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty,

24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it,

25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other.

26If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.

27Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it.

28 And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues.

29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles?

30 Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret?

31 But eagerly desire the greater gifts. And now I will show you the most excellent way.

Orderly Worship
Corinthians 14

26 What then shall we say, brothers? When you come together, everyone has a hymn, or a word of instruction, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church.

27 If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret.

28 If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God.

29 Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said.

30 And if a revelation comes to someone who is sitting down, the first speaker should stop.

31 For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged.

32 The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets.

33 For God is not a God of disorder but of peace.

God Bless you Ruth.

fttc said...

faithful

Can you tell me if anyone was arrested last week since you're at ground zero? I have heard from someone still in that some have been but they would not give any names. I cannot find anything in the news either.

Anonymous said...

5:13- with regard to what to read

I've read those- BOM, Bible, Journal of Discourses (does anyone read all of those...), but they didn't tell me what it is like to be a polygamist on a day in, day out basis. They give me the "why," but not the "how" That's what I want to understand so everyone's posts make more sense. Life is in the details!

Anonymous said...

Saw this posted on another site, is it true???

...the way I heered it, personal cleanliness is another problem with the good folks of Colorado City. Seems they are so hung up on maintaining the appearance of chastity that they won't even bathe properly. They'll stand under a shower, possibly even being mostly nakad, but they won't take soap and wash the various parts of their bodies. The result is about as if they never bathed at all and, way I heered it, some of the women there suffer from yeast infections because of improper hygene.

someone who knows said...

What life is like living in a family with plural mothers depends on who you're married to. I can only tell you what I have found to be the case in my situation.
1.I have found that in reality I am as married to my sister-wife as I am to my husband.She is the one I spend my days with, and she is my best friend.
2.Plural marriage CANNOT work when the people involved are selfish and,or uncaring.
3.In order for a plural relationship to work the husband must NEVER talk about or critisize one wife to another.
4.We believe in keeping our private moments private and sacred.We do not talk about our privacy to anyone, including the people in our own families.
5.Our children's closest friends and playmates are found in their own family, teaching them communication skills and how to interact with other people at a very young age.
6.Some mothers work , knowing their children are safe and cared for because the children are being tended by her best friend.
I am a home mom and I love my sister-wives children as much as if I had given birth to them myself.
The best thing about this lifestyle is that we never have to be lonely.Life for us is probably not so different from many other small community lifestyles.We work, play, take care of our children, do our dishes,laundry,and just live, like everyone else does.

Anonymous said...

Atari needs no defence. She said the way she seen it. I said it the way I see it.
Do you think the government will publish there evil? What would you people do for war then? They only look for people who hate us. Do you think they would give you there papers?
We are not in court here. This is only an opinion page. If you say I am stupid because I believe in Christ, and worship a man, that is your choice, not mine. I try to compell people toward peace.
To the one who said render to Ceasur what is cesurs. I have never known of cesure to have the gifts of God in his possesion. Therefore I have nothing of Cesures and the government has my money.
Filth and lies have been circulated about our church. I do not say that some things have not been done that were not right, but I say what I was tought in church was not the filthy lies circulated around about in the media.
And if some poor person did not bath, how terrible. I say sister in pheonix, hop in the tub. Maybe your river will run some truth in it.
Better yet, tell the truth and the truth will set you free. That is what I was counsled to do.
And some evil does not undo the truth of the scriptures. In all the history, men have followed the prophet's. Why is it strange to you that I do so too. We disagree on religion. Yes, that is our right. That does not mean I dislike you. and to 8;40 poster, I suggest you pray. If you do not understand reading, better pray or forget it. The why, but not the how, I have not heard that line before. Sound's like the weed talk again. You know, the "HOney, I am not like those guy's. I wont hurt you. Trust me. Just come into my truck for a bit." You know the one handed speech men out side of my church, make to take what they want, and then leave you stripped of dignity. Cause they are not like other men. They just want a little fun. nO commitment. Just a loose women and a bit of fun.

ATAR_i said...

Thanks Someone who Knows. The other day I had a party for my daughter, I had 13 girls, and I fed them dinner, they spent the night, and there was breakfast the next morning.

I was AMAZED at the amount of food consumed - and it was such an event to feed them all. How do women do it EVERY day - for all the meals. How do you homeschool THAT MANY - I would definately lose any marbles I now possess.

Ruth, I respect you - and I always have, since I read your poetry. I can see your heart and you have expressed such sorrowful events in your life. Yes, we disagree - but I appreciate your willingness to dialogue, and express your thoughts and feelings. I hope only good things for you.

Anonymous said...

Someone who knows....

From one house-mother to another, you listed how your day is similar to mine, but how is it different? i.e I spend 30 minutes doing my hair and makeup. I only have to feed two children, my husband sleeps in the same bed with me every night, and I worry about afording college for my children. In those respects and others how might your day be different?

L

Paladin for Truth said...

Many a person has told me to pray about Warren Jeff's message and get a testimony of Warren, and then I will get a testimony of the Sermons of our late Prophets and the Book of Mormon, etc. But is this the proper way to determine if his message is truly from God? The Bible does not say to test a prophet by prayer, but by his message. Read Galatians 1. Verse 1 tells what a true apostle is, "Paul an apostle--not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead." Verses 8-9 tell that even angels can bring a wrong message, "But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to that which we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, If any one is preaching to you a gospel contrary to that which you received, let him be accursed." Verse 10 is not to be taken lightly either,"Am I now seeking the favor of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still pleasing men, I should not be a servant of Christ.".
That was the Apostle Paul speaking, saying that if he or anyone one else preach that which is contrary to the Gospel, we should not listen. Paul was preaching in another place, teaching the true Gospel of Jesus Christ, Acts 17:11-12, "Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessaloni'ca, for they received the word with all eagerness, examining the scriptures daily to see if these things were so. Many of them therefore believed." Paul did not say go home and pray and get a testimony of me, and then you will understand the scripture, his teachings matched with what was already in print from the Savior. These people read daily and it says that many of them believed.
John warns us very well, 1 John 4:1 "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are of God; for many false prophets have gone out into the world." John explains why he was writing these things, 1 John 2:21 "I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and know that no lie is of the truth."
Peter also warns us very well, 2 Peter 2:1-3, "But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their licentiousness, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words; from of old their condemnation has not been idle, and their destruction has not been asleep.
Read Deuteronomy 13, for it surely states that a prophet must teach correctly about God. Chapter 18:10-22 tells us the prophet's prophecies must come to pass.
The day we live in has been forewarned about for a long time. Is it that people just can't see, or don't want to see?

Anonymous said...

I was rised with a big family. I liked this. I do not remember ever complaining about my brothers and sisters. My mothers all had special talents. I liked that. I liked the diversity. I went to school. I tended my brothers and sisters. This is what I grew up doing. I loved children. I never felt oppressed by them. I day dreamed about haveing children. When I had my children, it was a nateral thing. This is what I was tought. I loved them. I put my time in it. I tended my sister wifes children, why she worked at school. She had a lot of girls. I enjoyed this. She tought school. I have never lived alone. I go out. I see old women who live alone. I can not comprehend, ending up all alone, in my old age. I can not imagine only one women in the house. I can not imagine only a few children. I like my big family. Schooling is children learning. They go to school. Just like your children do. They are in private school. We have never been out of food. Not ever. I know that people that settled my comunity ate cabbage for a long time, but I never knew any one go with out food, to the point of starvation. Sure some time, but for the last twenty years, we have food. With big familys more people work. per quota, per person, The more the better. Just like this: an average person wastes enough food to feed two other people. We wasted no food. We grew gardens. We were thrifty. We work hard. WE play hard. WE love life to the fullest. With one or many. That is how we do it. If we fell short, God made up the difference. You may struggle so hard, because you are trying to go it alone. In Gods eyes the people who think they are the strongest are the weakest, because they do not depend on God for streanth. With out him, We would not even exist. Pride is aloneness. Pride is lonelyness. Pride is not sharing. The more you give the more you get. Try it.
one who knows.

Anonymous said...

I agree, The head of the church is conected to the body. Never have there been a true church that the arms and the legs have said, We have need of a new head. We shall cut it off, and put on a new one. Jesus is the head of the church. The people can not vote him in or out. Beleivers or unbelievers do not make him what he is. He was a God before. He had life and death in his hand. He was martered. He took up his life again in three day's. The earth begin to tremble at his removal off the earth. He had the power to hold it together. He did not live a system that men voted him in. ON the contrary. He said, "I came to do the will of my father." He turned over the money changers table. He cast devils out of the mamied. He walked a begger. He rode a donkey. He was persicuted. People sought his life. He was betrayed by his own deciple. He came to fill a mission. You came to fill a mission. I came to fill a mission. You have to seek out your purpose in life. I Have to mine. That is why it was written, The Americas as it was so. With liberty and justace for all. This is Gods law. I have been in my church for forty years. We have been sued for forty years. I have been persicuted, because I am a fundimentle morman for forty years. What is different? Some have confessed to believe and turned from there own confessions. Some have stood faithful. We have not lost our land.. The courts still try to take it. I hear talk that it is the morman church behind the persicution. They have the same books, but do not teach the same thing. We were born on the earth. They can not take our lands. If we were all in jail, we would be upon our lands. God gave us the americas. If we die, we are still upon our land. God gave us the americas. As a begger upon the street, we are still upon our lands. God gave us the americas. This great, great Morman church that daily confesses publicly that they have turned from the scriptures could sit us in there churches and read the book of morman and our faith would increase. We believe. They would not have to pass out there little slips of papers and call on us to read our slip. It is written in our heart and mind. "I will go and do the things that my father has required, because I know that he gives no comandment unto men, save he shall prepare a way to do so." "and Daniel did not bow down to the law that you should not worship this Christ." He did kneel and pray to his God. They did throw him into the lions den. And God closed there mouth.
The three that were thrown into the fire, and were not burned.
and men were poisened by there enamies and were not harmed.
Moses said, Mark your door. Set my people free. and the red sea parted and the children of Isreal did walk through on dry ground. And as he went into the mountian, and saw a burning bush, the people turned from the law. God did give them the lesser law. And Noah, said," when will the earth rest? And God opened his eyes. He saw a thousand years of peace. He saw that a people would be converted to the truth and Jesus himself would be the law giver. It is written, in days of old the angels went up before the people. In the millainial rein, Jesus himself will go before us. He will be our law giver and none else. In the days of his birth, they thought to kill the believers because the sign had not been given and God said, "this day it shall be given." and at his death the earth was rent." All people born upon the earth have a claim on God to be a member of his church. You chose him in the life before this one. Only the ones who forsake him will be banned from him. Why? because that was the choice they make. He loves all unconditionally. His law is unchangable. WE came here to train the body. Do you love God more than your stuff? Do you love each other more than your stuff? Who did you love as Jesus loves you? We are all sinners. He does Love you unconditionally. Who do you love unconditionally? This does not mean to sit and let someone abuse you, but you only have a right to make your choice. If you try to make anothers you have crossed the line. You have stepped into the realm of force. God is love. ARe you like him? I have searched my heart and feel to repent.

onthestreet said...

Anonymous Said: If your people must have a prophet, let the members of your religion vote one in. 7/10/2005/6:28PM

DONE! We vote Warren Jeffs.


Dear Ruth, Warren Jeffs has polluted Christ body his church. He has split up families, lied, misrepresented his message and broke the laws of God and man.

The only thing Warren Jeffs has done is his duty before God, to clean up the families, to cut off and pluck out what offends, and kept most strictly the true laws of God and man, those which are true and constitutional.

The events that are now coming upon you all, and those coming upon us, will decide the judgement of God between who and what is right. All talk at this point is rather pointless.

As for the claim that all have claim upon the gifts of God just by a profession of Jesus Christ, to hell with his Word regarding all that he said about faith being dead without works, this is just the devil in you all seducting you into that hell. Enjoy.

As for the claim that there is now, suddenly, because of charges, no need for a prophet, in every generation there MUST BE a head on the earth over the church of God. Cut that off, and the world is a chicken with its head cut off.

Not just one man? Yes, just one man. That is the head. Put two there, and you have Frankenstein, a monster, a two-headed THING that suddenly becomes far more grieveous that a true prophet who defies sin and crime in the midst of all your sins and crimes.

It is not Warren Jeffs who has polluted the body of Christ. It is the cast-off body of Christ who polluted the body of Chirst. There is no member of the body of Christ without that head.

There. Now you have it like it is. Love it or lump it.

Yes, God bless Ruth and Truth, and curse the uncouth.

onthestreet said...

Anonymous said...
5:13- with regard to what to read.

TRY DR. SUESS

fttc said...

1:14

I am sorry to burst your bubble but there are those not following warren whohave NOT turned against your books. Who have NOT turned against thier confession. The accusation you make against the 'great Mormon church' are the very things warren has created in the FLDS. Former teachings have become false by him. He has given "greater light" which has not added to the scriptures, but has taken away from them. The destruction of family and desolation of souls that follow in his wake are the fruits of his labors and will stand as a testimony against him at the judgement day. He has so effectively blinded the people that one such as you with your knowledge of the scriptures has even been deceived. Our people knowing the truth do not love it as such but as Paul spoke of some people in his day they seek after every new thing, loving sensation rather than the simple truths of the Gospel. I have lived among it all my life and am a witness to this myself.

In the last fory years we have not been persecuted. Where have been the mobs, the killings, the driving off your property? If you are being persecuted now it is because you have not followed the counsel of those whose right it was to rule. You have sought the counsel of men instead of the teachings of Christ.

ATAR_i said...

I am really enjoying the dialogue you guys are having. Perhaps a few more paragraphs in the long ones would make them easier to read. Keep it up. It's good.

Anonymous said...

Read The Journal's And Tell me where the Main Stream Morman Church follows even One of the original Teachings. Where are the women who are not afraid to be women. Where are the women that multiply and replenish the Earth. Were are the People who live the United Order? Where are the People that are unique? You claim to believe the bible, the book of morman. Where is the works of thy believe? Where is a people who make the home important? Jobs, world glory is your gain. Mainstream Mormianized world glory. You do not where your garments except for your show in your church. YOu do not cover your bodies. Your children are not chaste. One requirement to get in your church is to denounce the principles your church was suposed to have been set up on. Mormans have forgotten Morminism, and joined the ranks of pretend-ism. They worship with thier lips, and their harts are far from him. Do you read it the way it is wrote, or did you say, "That was for then, in that day, but we live in a modern day." "I believe what Joeseph tought. I believe what Brigham tought, but it was for that day. If they were here to day, they would not fit in." Yes, a modern day where you teach the fallacy of your own religion.

fttc said...

You know at least the Mormons acknowledge that it was true in Joseph's day and Brigham's day. Warren teaches that things were just false all along. His teachings supercede any former teachings and if the former does not agree then they must have been wrong. Higher light and knowledge indeed!

Anonymous said...

fttc
Do you seek light or do you also teach corruption. Your lies do smell like, the swags in the sea, at thirty-five hundred miles away. What Brigham tought is as true today as it was then. It applys to you as well as me. You have arightto chose it or leave it. Freedom and Justice for all, with liverty. Under God. What did you choose? ARe you a traitor to your country as well as your church, and the teachings of the prophets. It is one thing to beleive what you want. IT is another to try to take away another persons right to freedom and worship.

fttc said...

It is easy to throw out accusations. I have stated specific actions of your prophet that are evil and have produced destruction. You are not willing to address those issues.

onthestreet said...

Ahh, but specific actions that are evil against evil, and produce destruction upon that evil.

NOW THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT MATTER

Anonymous said...

But a house divided against itself cannot stand!

Anonymous said...

Ok Dear Street,

You said "It is not Warren Jeffs who has polluted the body of Christ. It is the cast-off body of Christ who polluted the body of Chirst. There is no member of the body of Christ without that head."

STREET...I suppose the prophet Warren Jeffs is the head?

Street said "As for the claim that all have claim upon the gifts of God just by a profession of Jesus Christ, to hell with his Word regarding all that he said about faith being dead without works, this is just the devil in you all seducting you into that hell. Enjoy."

As for works. How many WORKS DID THE THIEF ON THE CROSS DO BEFORE JESUS TOOK HIM TO PARADISE WITH HIM? ANSWER ME THAT STREET. IT IS CALLED GRACE, GRACE, GRACE.

Street who do you think gives us faith? God through Christ through the Holy Spirit.

God will honor Faith as small as a mustard seed, that is pretty small and at that God gives it to us.

We cannot take credit for salvation no matter what we do or say. It is a gift of his Son Jesus Christ, from our loving God.

Street said "It is the cast-off body of Christ who polluted the body of Chirst."

Street....Did Jesus rip Peter the Rock of His Church from the body of His Church when he denied knowing Jesus three times before the crucfixion? NO.. He told him after his resurrection Peter feed my sheep. Peter feed my sheep. He did not cast him off.

Street and any other FLDS person.

When Jesus forgives you He forgives completely. His blood has covered your sins (past and present and future). As a child of His you are going to sin, and grieve the Holy Spirit, but he does not cut you off. He loves you. If you believe he died, was resurrected and lives and is the Son of God, he will not cut you off. He might set you straight, but he does not cut you off.

WORKS alone will not get you into the gates of Heaven, Street. If that was the case, Jesus would not had to been the sacrifice.

If you turn your life over to Christ you will strive to do good works through your faith, with the help of the Holy Spirit. I said with the help of the Holy Spirit which Jesus sent to us. He does not leave us alone once we turn our lives over to Him.

Christ will not let any of his sheep go.

Just because Warren cast out the sheep, does to mean Christ has cast them out. He does not work that way.

People read the Bible and even the Book of Mormon, don't trust what I say, or Street or Warren. The Holy Spirit will guided you if you are Christ Sheep.

Little Bow Peep

onthestreet said...

Well, at least someone is thinking a little. Yet, in using the term "evil against evil," that is to say warfare, the goodly fight against that which is evil. Then, the good doing battle with evil has an evil effect to those who are evil, but good to those who are good. Then it is a house reinforced, not divided.

onthestreet said...

This last post in response to
Anonymous, who said...
But a house divided against itself cannot stand! 7/11/2005 2:43 PM

onthestreet said...

Little Boy Peep: 3:27PM:

Sure, let's check the validity of your twistings.

1. How many works had the thief? FIRST: He was probably stealing from a dumpster to feed his family, thus harming no one. Who knows the circumstances of the accused.

SECOND: He had performed the works of sacrifice in sacrificing his feelings and his ego to the point of confessing his own nothingness before the good man accused yet dying for us all.

THIRD: Is the Word of God true? "Faith without works is dead."

2. Who gives us faith as a mustard seed. You skirt a crucial point: The mustard seed grows into a very large plant, and speads more seed everywhere, multiplying and replenishing the earth. So without that, your faith is vain. Now who gives that true seed? It is directed of God, through a prophet, as the parables and other teachings of Christ clearly show. Just to name one:

"To some a hundred, to some fifty, and to some thirty (wives).

"The unfruitful shall be cast off." What did he do when the fig tree had no fruit? He cursed it.

3. Yes, salvation is a gift, but there are nine degrees. Do you want the bottom of the totem-pole where devils lurk, or the top where God and angels dwell?

4. Peter and others denied with their mouth in the wisdom of God, yet they were not cast off, for they remained faithful.

5. Who says the Lord will not cut people off. He says that very thing. "If so and so offend thee, CUT IT OFF." If so and so proclaims in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not proclaimed many good things in thy name. And I will say to them, "Get ye hense, ye cursed."

See, you all speak fables to try and justify a laxity of morals and faithfulness.

6. Now it is plain that you are correct in that people cannot trust what you say.

Anonymous said...

I remember Uncle Rulon telling us to get rid of our Dr. Seuss books... oh and that's one vote for warren if we want to keep count!

Anonymous said...

here's the latest for KSL what d you think?

KINGMAN, Ariz. (AP) -- Seven or eight residents of the polygamous community of Colorado City -- all sought on alleged sex offenses involving underage polygamous wives -- are expected to surrender today in Kingman.

Mohave County Attorney Matt Smith says under an agreement with the men's attorney, all were to be booked and then released on 25-hundred-dollars bond each.

Another Colorado City resident who was arrested Friday was in court in Kingman today.

Forty-eight-year-old David Bateman pleaded innocent to charges of sexual conduct with a minor and conspiracy to commit sexual conduct with a minor

Fried Female said...

Poor guys. Usta be that when a man was "given" an underage girl and then prosecuted for it, the "Priesthood" would fight their legal battles for them and use their lawyers and everybody would pay the bill.

Now the lawyers are pretty much dumped and the "priesthood" is nowhere to be found. Wonder who's gonna clean up the mess that was created by the ones in hiding?

Fried Female said...

Oh, and to anonymous 7/9 @ 11:19--

YOU are the one with the failed memory. Or it is just conveniently misled, like in so many other issues.

Uncle Rulon DID NOT make that announcement about Winston. If you will be honest with yourself, you will remember that it was Warren who made that pronouncement and then blamed it on his father, who sat silently by. And then, just like every other meeting for the year prior to that, Uncle Rulon had to ask Warren what he should say and if he should say more. Sounds like he was in charge, all right.

Anonymous said...

Ya, ok, what ever: take the matter up with Jesus. See if you can convince him that winston is still in the church and teaches the same as he did ten years ago. Look at his wifes, and compare yourself, Was that split skirts or was it my imagination and were can you find the scripture that the daughters of Zion shall put on indecency and stand on the right hand of Christ? Just a thought. I am not your judge or your maker. Take the matter up with him, and I will say nothing else. And if you speak thus of our Prophet,I think you speak of your own apostisy. I know Uncle Rulon was Perfect before God.

ATAR_i said...

Hmmmm, how is it you know anothers relationship with God. Only God can see a man's heart. That's a pretty bold statement to make.

You can guess, by all appearances - but you can never KNOW

onthestreet said...

Certainly, under normal circumstances, you can't know, without ascending to that level.

Anonymous said...

Why is it everything one of Winstons wifes do is blamed on him?
Do you realy think that they can't make any choices on their own? Winston teaches the correct princibles then lets his people govern them self. That is how he has tought for 20 years. I know I was there

ATAR_i said...

You can't know PERIOD.

Faithful Woman said...

9:42 pm

There was but one perfect man. It wasn't Uncle Rulon. He would have been the first to say so.

Anonymous said...

It doesn't seem fair to judge all by what one person does. If one cop is a jackass, does that make them all?

onthestreet said...

Yes, Uncle Rulon is a perfect man, as is his son Uncle Warren, as perfect as many angels. I KNOW from personal experience, and you all know NOTHING except having been caught in your crimes by him, and cast off as chaff.

Gloat over that, you yella-bellies. You can always tell when people have been eating "yellow-jelly." They've got yellow-bellies.

An ignoble, uncourageous person: coward , craven , dastard ,
funk , poltroon.

Warren is the opposite, having been courageous enough to cast out evil, even to pack up and leave it all, and then to build a new city in the face of such opposition, and a House for the Lord. He has definately not "run" nor "hidden" under a bushel. Yet, like Christ, he "left Jerusalem" and hid from the people, for his time was not yet. He is a perfect man, Christ-like, whether anyone else likes it or lumps it all up into a very tight wad. It is NOT a tight-wad to build a city and a house to the Lord. The tight wads are all who seek to take that away. They've got their brain all up tight, and their heart and groin in a wad.

Any comments?

Anonymous said...

ONTHESTREEt= The PERFECT JaCKASS,Always braying,never praying,LOVES Warren yet hates him.

onthestreet said...

Hey, maybe I can be a true vehicle for my Lord and yours, Jesus Christ. His very choice for a vehicle of conveyance was a JACKASS.

Anonymous said...

I dont think Onthestreet or any other Apostate is a vehicle for the Lord.Street you are a vehicle for the DEVIL!

onthestreet said...

Ahh, what is an apostate. Abel and Alvin were without the blessings, apparently, and were seen at the right hand of God. Job was cursed, and cursed not God. Jesus was crucified, and ascended into heaven

Anonymous said...

ONTHESTREET said"AHH what is a Apostate?LOOK in the mirror!You will see an APOSTATE!"ONE WHO REJECTED THE PROPHET AND HIS TESTIMONY.!

onthestreet said...

I seek to accept and to fulfill, and in judging I can only look in the mirror.

ATAR_i said...

How do you know that warren and rulon were perfect? Were you with them all the moments of their lives, and could you read their every thought?

No, you could not, and you do not know the heart of any man - you cannot judge it.

Anonymous said...

Going back to an earlier post, why did Unlce Rulon say to get rid of Dr. Seuss's books? What other reading was off-limits?

OTS, I would love to see your photo because you seem like such a character!

Anonymous said...

Hey tell Warren guys to stop feeding him "Yellow Jelly" as OTS suggest then mabey he will man enough to come foward.

Anonymous said...

Does Winston Blackmore do placement marriages like Warren?

Anonymous said...

Why don't you go to the "share the light" blog and ask him. He'll be glad to answer you. Go to sharethelight.ca/b2

Anonymous said...

We were told to get rid of all books that were not "real", meaning having only real things in them. ie: animals, or people. Also novels, because they planted lustful desires in your heart. We were not supposed to have tv's not even just for family home videos.

Anonymous said...

How do I know the prophets are, and were and will be perfect into eternity? By the spirit of God, the things of God are known. How do you know Jesus is the Christ. Were can you find in his law that it is permisssable to promote false hoods? I say go out in the tree's and do as James. Ask of God. Let there be no disputations among you. I am a messenger, upon the earth. Who of you are enjoying the destruction of others? Who is propmoting the Gospel of Christ?

Anonymous said...

I bet Warren is at Mac Blackmores ranch in canada

Anonymous said...

I bet he isn't, he dosent even like Mac.

Anonymous said...

He doesn't like anybody but his own precious self. But that wouldn't stop him from using someone to hide his sorry arse for his own benefit.

onthestreet said...

OTS, I would love to see your photo because you seem like such a character! 7/12/2005 8:57 PM

I AM SAM.

ATAR_i said...

None is perfect but God, and the son of God, the lamb without blemish. There was but ONE of those.

Adam thought it might be ok to be equal with God - and look where that got him.

ATAR_i said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
onthestreet said...

Ruth, If what you say is truth then why are Warren and his minions scurrying away to Texas? Texas is far from the Rockies.
7/09/2005 10:46 AM

And the seed of the woman shall flee into the wilderness on two wings. (Rev.12).

onthestreet said...

ATAR_i said...How do you know that warren and rulon were perfect? Were you with them all the moments of their lives, and could you read their every thought? No, you could not, and you do not know the heart of any man - you cannot judge it.
7/12/2005 7:38 PM

STREET's Response: The abyss is to know. It comes after the sacrifice, the purification, the joyful service, and the union. Then the abyss, beyond the heart. Then you know (M-Y-Mm-T-D).
There it is.

onthestreet said...

Adam thought it might be ok to be equal with God - and look where that got him. 7/13/2005 6:00 PM

Ahh, it got him onto the very Throne of God. Adam is Michael the archangel. "Michael is our Father and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do."

He it was who overshadowed the Virgin Mary. He it was who brought forth his Son from the tomb. He it is who shall now conduct the battle of the Great God.

See how you respond, and thus how impoverished you are in the abyss.

ATAR_i said...

Piffle - Adam sinned and was kicked out of the garden you schmuck.

didn't even read your whole paragraph - you bore me - it's rot and nonsense.

Anonymous said...

Street your MO should be
I AM SPAM, I AM SPAM, I AM SPAM.

TO BAD THIS BLOG DOESN'T HAVE A SPAM BLOCKER.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Street your MO should be
I AM SPAM, I AM SPAM, I AM SPAM.

TO BAD THIS BLOG DOESN'T HAVE A SPAM BLOCKER.

Forgot to sign.
Little Bow Peep

onthestreet said...

LOL

feralfem said...

Atari,
In reference to your "...it's rot and nonsense." and given your curiosity about all things FLDS, I thought you might be interested to know that Street is referring to a fundamental doctrine of the FLDS written by Joseph W. Musser, published by the Truth Publishing Company, 1963, titled "Michael, Our Father and our God." The doctrine is also referred to as "the Adam-God doctrine."

The entire text of President Musser's little pamphlet can be found online at:

http://mormonfundamentalism.org/old/michael.txt

Whether WSJ has tossed that doctrine aside, is beyond my knowledge at this point, but it was certainly taught by all the preisthood brethren in the early days before the one-man-rule came about in the early 1980's. As with a number of other doctrines and gospel that Joseph Smith taught, the mainstream LDS has rejected it as written by Musser.

Namaste

ATAR_i said...

Thanks for the follow up, that's a new one for me.

Anonymous said...

I hope I don't offend with my comments, but I am truly heartbroken by anyone in any form of religion who is so brainwashed that they refuse to even attempt to try and educate themselves in history, and take an opinion on the past for themselves. If you of the FLDS were to visit a public library, even in the conservative city of Salt Lake, you could browse the history shelves of RECORDED FACTS WRITTEN AT THE TIME THAT THEY STATE THEY OCCUR, on an endless variety of subjects that you've never been exposed to. I am truly sorry if you can't accept it, but THEY ARE TRUE! The world is not 6000 years old. It is millions of years old, and humans have been around for millions of years. THAT IS A FACT. Even those of you who don't believe this FLDS enslavement/human misery cult, might not know that, but MODERN human remains MILLIONS of years old have been found. You come to these pages saying that you are against Warren Jeffs, but you follow his belief system to a T. You are completely ignorant to the fact that the bible is not the word of god. It is the word of man, and even these ORIGINAL incredible stories, WRITTEN BY MAN I REMIND YOU, have been distorted multiple times through the centuries by other men. That "Approved by government" bible, is the SAME ONE that ALL Christian faiths refer to. It does not accurately state even the original scriptures. It has been edited and revised to fit the opinions of people in POWER throughout history. People who manipulated large amounts of people, for their own benefit, both financially, and for POWER. People like those who founded and hold office in the high echelons of the FLDS leadership. CULT MANIPULATORS. Remember that you have been manipulated since birth. You do not understand the real world, which is such a vast area around you, that your censored minds could truly not even fathom how magnificent, diverse, and immense it is. The earth is an endless place of so many wonders, and it could never be explored in a lifetime. If you are truly worried about the government destroying your faith, then I'd suggest you don't post any more public statements like those I've read here. They only further give the federal authorities who aren't living in Joseph Smith's fantasy world of manipulation, a reason to want to put everyone running this cult into jail. You should not have to suffer physically, emotionally, or spiritually for a place in heaven. Why would a god place us here to make us suffer? Why should women be submissive and bow to their man's every whim? Why not read a novel and learn. Everyone I've read posting on here from an FLDS community has no sense of grammer, spelling, or even the proper way to write a simple idea to another person. And it's sad, because it's not their fault. They aren't allowed proper schooling because "The Prophet", or "Some Manipulative Douche-Bag" says that public school is evil. Parents giving their children away in marriage to family members? That is why you have a baby graveyard. A Baby Graveyard IS NOT GOD'S WAY. MARRIAGE WITHIN FAMILY IS NOT GOD'S WAY. IT IS JOSEPH SMITH'S WAY TO MAKE A MIND CONTROLLED CASH MACHINE, AND IT'S BEING RUN BY ALL OF THOSE FAMILIES WITH NAMES THAT KEEP POPPING UP IN NEWS AROUND OUR COUNTRY. OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE! LEAVE! You obviously have access to the internet! What do you use it for? Have you ever searched for the term "FLDS", and wonder why all of the pages that pop up are questioning how such activities could happen in our world. You just don't understand because you are completely brainwashed. Visit www.davidicke.com and even though it is really outrageous, if you read through it, and try to say to yourself, "This could be possible" as you read it and analyze it for yourself, then you will realize that unfortunately, David Icke's Reptilian theory has more facts than the crap you believe.

onthestreet said...

"And it's sad, because it's not their fault. They aren't allowed proper schooling because "The Prophet", or "Some Manipulative Douche-Bag" says that public school is evil."

STREET's Reply: The FLDS people have THE MOST proper schooling on the planet, bar none. Now, I'm not talking your sick science saying that God isn't God, and your sick morals teaching gradeschoolers about contraception and aborting babies, and your sick everything else EXCEPT GOD. I'm talking the schooling that is meet for salvation. Yup, it is bar none.

Yes, the public schools are MOST EVIL. Satan rules there, or you wouldn't have that epidemic of Satanic doctrines taught there, now would you. ENJOY YOUR DEMONS. They will find a more proper schooling for you in Hell.

onthestreet said...

IT IS NOW EVEN ILLEGAL TO PRAY IN THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS, OR TO TEACH ANYTHING ABOUT GOD.

AND YOU CALL THAT "A PROPER PUBLIC SCHOOLING!

ATAR_i said...

Well, I don't think FLDS has their arms wrapped around the best education - only because the education stops. I think it's possible to instruct children WELL even in a more primitive environment.

However, that doesn't seem to happen for the necessary amount of time for FLDS kids. Although I don't know the curriculum - it seems to me - NOT going to school is one of the biggest culprits.

As a product of an exclusive private school I will say they do have their benefits.

I have sent my children to private and then public. Since I live in a nice area - the public school was not the den of inquity I had always been taught it was - that was a nice suprise.

I don't agree with your assessment of the Bible, it's changes etc, but you've a right to your opinion.

Anonymous said...

Well, I myself am really glad that prayer is not allowed in school. Schooling and religion have no place together, as school is the teaching of skills, facts, and knowledge, and religion is based entirely on faith in something written by man. 66% of the entire world do not believe in the Christian faith. FLDS has 10,000 members? You are a single blade of grass amongst the millions of the earth. Yet, you shun all people outside of your society? You are hateful, ignorant people. There is no love in your society. You may think that is what it is, but your minds have been warped into thinking that ritualistic abuse is God's way. As for not agreeing with my assesment of the bible, there are records that even the Vatican would claim to be accurate, regarding King James and a council of politicians deciding what would be in the "New Testament", and what they would leave out. And, while we're at it, what needs to be changed. That is why it is the "King James" New Testament. It's a fact, not an assessment.

Anonymous said...

RE: books banned by Warren

anything putting down father image
or putting up women's image
anything using caricatures or talking animals etc
anything with uncovered bodies (including short sleeves/pants)
anything with anything in it
anything not true life story
anything with dinosaurs, blacks
anything love related
anything period

onthestreet said...

Right, saints BAN all lies, not some but ALL.

ATAR_i said...

You'll have to give an outside reference for your "facts" on the Bible - I don't believe it - but I'll look at your information.

Anonymous said...

****onthestreet said...
Right, saints BAN all lies, not some but ALL. ****
Agreed. That means onthestreet will have to stop posting.

ATAR_i said...

Yep - your gonna have to stop posting - we've banned lies.

onthestreet said...

Ah shucks, why would you ban yourself? You've practically converted yourself already into something less animal, more human.

ATAR_i said...

I've always been human - I don't believe in evolution street. I'm suprised you do.

Anonymous said...

OTC is the "missing link" they've always needed to prove it.

Anonymous said...

lol